file sharing in the 21st century

scottalanmiller

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

how does NC protect against cryptoware on a WebDAV share

There is an app for NC called Ransomware protection where can add extension patterns and exclude extensions patterns. It kind of works like Windows File Screening.

We use that, too.

JaredBusch

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

Also syncing, in my opinion. Is mostly for offline access, do your users have offline access now?

I don't think that that is often the case. Lots of people want to do that for just simple, transparent access. Lots of people dislike using the web interface to get to files.

So how do you keep problems out when syncing 100’s of GB?

How many people need to sync 100s of GBs of files? That's not normal.

If you don’t sync a file how do you get access to it? Web only?

Who needs access to that many files? Not our users, or our normal customers.

Web or WebDAV mount.

So you end up with a mixed use of sync and WebDAV.

I need access to hundreds or thousands of files on our shared drive, but I don’t need them synced... so WebDAV is my solution... how does NC protect against cryptoware on a WebDAV share?

backups, its the only true solution to cryptoware.

Versioning protects perfectly. Exablox has 100% ransomeware protection through continuous versioning, for example.

When NC does versioning, does it hide it from the typical file share browsing so that a cryptoware doesn’t know that “backup” is there?
I ask because I’ve never used any type of versioning before.

Then stop asssuming and saying random shit.

No intelligent filesync system puts versions on the local system. Not even OneDrive. Version history is in the web interface like everything else.

Obsolesce

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

I mentioned this in another thread, but I currently have a file server which is a 2012R2 VM sharing roughly 6TB of data. I am looking into replacing this with something more modern, so far I am checking out Nextcloud.

But having read most of the threads on ML dealing with nextcloud, and especially reading about experiences such as @guyinpv had here and here, I think we need to take a hard look at how we share files now, and why we do it the way we do it, and maybe find other methods and philosophies that we could implement for a better overall experience.

In a lot of ways, I can relate to @guyinpv, as his setup sounds a lot like mine. We currently have our VM, with a single share that is applied as a mapped drive using GPO. Inside this share is a number of root level folders, basically one for each department. Inside each of these are the typical level of nested subfolders and files. All of the first couple levels of folders from the share root were created by me, and users are locked out of being able to make changes until they are a few layers deep into their department.

Based on my research and conversations I have had, I think we have a very narrow idea of what a file share should be like, because all we know is how windows operates. As far as we treat the system, there is no one that "owns" any of the files, even though windows records an owner. No one has any sort of personal or private files that they "share" with other users. The files exist in the share that we created, and both users likely have equal permissions to said file.

I would like to expand my horizons, because I don't feel like I fully understand how other companies might use something like NC. If we are to take full advantage of what NC offers, it may require a fundamental shift in thinking by us and I want to get started on that now.

How do other people use NC? Specifically, how are folder structures or other structures, and how does that relate to user accounts? What does the anatomy of a cloud based solution look like when done well? I think I would like to use the sync client in windows, but I have only just started to play around with an online demo.

I think it's best to instead figure out what the business needs and and goals are for file service needs, and then find the appropriate technology to meet those... instead of picking out a cool featurful technology first, and the seeing if you can squeeze the businesses needs into it.

black3dynamite

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

JaredBusch

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

This is what I do. Except , I just used windows settings to change the location of C:\Users\Username\Documents

Totally spaced on using links... Damnit.

dbeato

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

I dont really want to dive any deeping into MS's pockets if I can avoid it.

What are you using for email? If using O365 you likely already have OneDrive for business

we currently have hosted exchange, not o365, but I want to switch. We pay way too much. I am not sure what I want to switch to.

Zimbra, woot!

HIPAA compliant?

I mean, that is another debate for another post but certainly can be depending what you determine what is HIPAA Compliance for your business.

scottalanmiller

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

I dont really want to dive any deeping into MS's pockets if I can avoid it.

What are you using for email? If using O365 you likely already have OneDrive for business

we currently have hosted exchange, not o365, but I want to switch. We pay way too much. I am not sure what I want to switch to.

Zimbra, woot!

HIPAA compliant?

I assume this is tongue in cheek, as of course, it is HIPAA compliant.

scottalanmiller

@dbeato said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

I dont really want to dive any deeping into MS's pockets if I can avoid it.

What are you using for email? If using O365 you likely already have OneDrive for business

we currently have hosted exchange, not o365, but I want to switch. We pay way too much. I am not sure what I want to switch to.

Zimbra, woot!

HIPAA compliant?

I mean, that is another debate for another post but certainly can be depending what you determine what is HIPAA Compliance for your business.

Right, as software doesn't have or not have HIPAA compliance, there is no concept of such in HIPAA.

Emad R

The big difference is share the files take 10 GB in that share with NC it takes 10 GB on your machine and the share, that said it is nice to have an extra copy. However, some mentioned that there is a workaround but it is not what NC meant to do by default (spoken like true NC engineer that I am not ).

Emad R

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

black3dynamite

@Emad-R said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

I make junction points for the root directories under C:\Users\john.doe\ except for AppData directory and then create a Local Files Only or Personal Files in john.doe directory so they can keep their crap there. No other partitions.

Dashrender

@JaredBusch said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

This is what I do. Except , I just used windows settings to change the location of C:\Users\Username\Documents

Totally spaced on using links... Damnit.

So you could have gotten hit by the 1809 folder redirection data loss problem.

Dashrender

@Emad-R said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

If a user is working outside where you want them to have data, ultimately there is nothing you can do other than fire them. Users who want to find a way around your stuff, likely will. The question would be —-why are they?

JaredBusch

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Emad-R said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

If a user is working outside where you want them to have data, ultimately there is nothing you can do other than fire them. Users who want to find a way around your stuff, likely will. The question would be —-why are they?

Anything not saved where it is supposed to be means I don’t give a fuck if you lose it.

JaredBusch

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@JaredBusch said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

This is what I do. Except , I just used windows settings to change the location of C:\Users\Username\Documents

Totally spaced on using links... Damnit.

So you could have gotten hit by the 1809 folder redirection data loss problem.

Well the default NC location is C:\Users\username\Nextcloud.

So would that have potentially been affected anyway? It didn’t hit my test upgrades I did before it was pulled.

Dashrender

@JaredBusch said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Dashrender said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@JaredBusch said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

This is what I do. Except , I just used windows settings to change the location of C:\Users\Username\Documents

Totally spaced on using links... Damnit.

So you could have gotten hit by the 1809 folder redirection data loss problem.

Well the default NC location is C:\Users\username\Nextcloud.

So would that have potentially been affected anyway? It didn’t hit my test upgrades I did before it was pulled.

No, I wouldn't expect the Nextcloud folder to be affected, it's not one of MS's folders. The main ones affected were /desktop and /documents. If either of these were redirected to another location (assuming c:\users\username\Nextcloud\desktop, c:\users\username\Nextcloud\documents), and there were files left behind in the old(original) location, then you could have been bit.

JaredBusch

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Emad-R said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

I make junction points for the root directories under C:\Users\john.doe\ except for AppData directory and then create a Local Files Only or Personal Files in john.doe directory so they can keep their crap there. No other partitions.

Assuming the folder structure exists within the Nextcloud folder, this is what I just came up with today.
Obviously, the data in these directories needs to already have been moved to the appropriate Nextcloud folders.
LinkNextcloud.ps1 has to be executed in an elevated PS sessions so i have it prompt for the username.

# Save file as LinkNextcloud.ps1
$User = Read-Host "Enter UserName"
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Desktop" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Desktop" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Desktop" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Documents" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Documents" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Documents" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Downloads" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Downloads" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Downloads" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Favorites" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Favorites" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Favorites" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Music" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Music" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Music" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Pictures" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Pictures" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Pictures" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Videos" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Videos" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Videos" -Force

Definitely room for improvement.. Just pulled this out of my ass today to resolve an issue.

black3dynamite

@JaredBusch said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@Emad-R said in file sharing in the 21st century:

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

We mainly use NC as a replacement for folder redirection w/ offline at work and its been working great. Each users root folders like Desktop and Documents are moved into the Nextcloud directory and then use symbolic link (junction points) to point to each folder in the Nextcloud directory.

Noice, so you make Junction point on (C:)\Users\Username or only on Desktop and Documents and stuff like that.

What if that fucker starting to save files on the (D:) and gave you a D or you dont make any other partition

I make junction points for the root directories under C:\Users\john.doe\ except for AppData directory and then create a Local Files Only or Personal Files in john.doe directory so they can keep their crap there. No other partitions.

Assuming the folder structure exists within the Nextcloud folder, this is what I just came up with today.
Obviously, the data in these directories needs to already have been moved to the appropriate Nextcloud folders.
LinkNextcloud.ps1 has to be executed in an elevated PS sessions so i have it prompt for the username.
# Save file as LinkNextcloud.ps1
$User = Read-Host "Enter UserName"
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Desktop" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Desktop" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Desktop" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Documents" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Documents" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Documents" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Downloads" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Downloads" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Downloads" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Favorites" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Favorites" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Favorites" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Music" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Music" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Music" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Pictures" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Pictures" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Pictures" -Force
Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$User\Videos" -Force -Confirm
New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$User" -Name "Videos" -Target "C:\Users\$User\Nextcloud\Videos" -Force
Definitely room for improvement.. Just pulled this out of my ass today to resolve an issue.

I got the idea from this site but with my own needs. I still have to clean up my script.
https://helgeklein.com/blog/2015/02/manual-folder-redirection-with-symbolic-links/

black3dynamite

Its near the bottom of the page that says "Symbolic Link Folder Redirection Script"

JaredBusch

@black3dynamite said in file sharing in the 21st century:

Its near the bottom of the page that says "Symbolic Link Folder Redirection Script"

Will read that..

My script updated, not tested yet.

$UserName = Read-Host "Enter UserName"
$CreateNextCloudFolder = Read-Host "Is this a new Nextcloud user Y/N?"

$FolderList = "Desktop,Documents,Downloads,Favorites,Music,Pictures,Videos"
$FoldderArray = $FolderList.split(",")

ForEach($Folder in $FolderArray) {
    If($CreateNextCloudFolder -like "y") {
        New-Item -ItemType Directory -Path "C:\Users\$UserName\Nextcloud\$Folder" -Force
    }
    Remove-Item -Path "C:\Users\$UserName\$Folder" -Force -Confirm
    New-Item -ItemType Junction -Path "C:\Users\$UserName" -Name "$Folder" -Target "C:\Users\$UserName\Nextcloud\$Folder" -Force
}