VM Suggestions? Best Practice?
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@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
That isn't how Hyper-V works.
It's Hyper-V with a Windows 10 Dom 0. On which you can build a Windows 10 guest on top of.
Windows is never on the hardware when Hyper-V is involved. .
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@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
He was, but he claimed that running the VMs would be a total PITA to do any other way - and like this whole thread has been saying - While being forced to live the root life in a Linux OS, he could easily have a Windows 10 VM in KVM to do his personal daily stuff, while also using KVM to have as many more Win 10 VMs for testing - and the snaps for rollbacks, etc.
I basically beat Dustin to saying this is all.
@Obsolesce the issue is the laptop he purchased is a toy you'd purchase for a toddler or kid, maybe even lower grade depending on who you ask.
@Dashrender no you didn't. Have you read this entire topic?
I beat you to telling it to @Obsolesce , not Wrcombs. read the entire nested thread.
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@Dashrender ah, well in that case. . .
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@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@black3dynamite said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Speaking of old computers, how soon is too soon to get (toddlers and kids) to use a computer?
My kid started with a tablet and then a computer.
But at what age?
Tablet at 1, computer at 3.
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@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
Windows 10 HOME. No Hyper-V.
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@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
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But with Hyper-V, it is a Windows VM that gets that benefit. And with KVM it is Linux that gets it.
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@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
That isn't how Hyper-V works.
It's Hyper-V with a Windows 10 Dom 0. On which you can build a Windows 10 guest on top of.
Windows is never on the hardware when Hyper-V is involved. .
I know EXACTLY how Hyper-V works.
See:
https://mangolassi.it/post/344794
and:
https://mangolassi.it/post/401537
In modern Hyper-V, a Windows 10 VM does not run on top of the parent partition.
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@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
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@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
A guest is a guest. Are you asking if Windows on KVM acts like Windows with Hyper-V and a dom0 Windows?
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@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
A guest is a guest. Are you asking if Windows on KVM acts like Windows with Hyper-V and a dom0 Windows?
Scott says Dom0 gets priority over other VMs - so no, a guest is not a guest, assuming he's right.
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@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
A guest is a guest. Are you asking if Windows on KVM acts like Windows with Hyper-V and a dom0 Windows?
Scott says Dom0 gets priority over other VMs - so no, a guest is not a guest, assuming he's right.
Dom0 isn't a guest though.
Guests are guests, anything that is not running on the hardware is a guest. So any Vm you setup after you setup the hypervisor is a guest.
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Hyper-v is built-in to the Windows Desktop operating system. It's there, so why not use it?
We have a number of machines that are beefed up with solid-state drives and 64GB of RAM or more to test setups, deploy pre-release bits, test client's setups for blow-outs, and more.
Windows 10 introduced automatic snapshots. Keep this in mind if setting up a lab, working it, and leaving it running as the differencing disks will continue to grow. The snapshots can be used to step-back if something does indeed blow up.
And, it's a great way to learn the PowerShell needed to set up, manage, and tear down Hyper-V based virtual machines.
EDIT: We set up the labs on a Private Virtual Switch to keep the VMs isolated. If they need Internet access we set up a VM with two vNICs and install Server 2008 R2 along with RRAS to act as a NAT for the lab subnet. We can tweak DNS to allow for access to Internet facing services in the lab with the appropriate rules set up on RRAS. There are freebie edge software setups out there that could be used in place of Server 2008 R2.
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@PhlipElder said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Hyper-v is built-in to the Windows Desktop operating system. It's there, so why not use it?
It isn't built in, it's available to be installed to the hardware and lift the Windows environment up to a Dom0 status.
Different and not at all the same as "built in".
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@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@PhlipElder said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Hyper-v is built-in to the Windows Desktop operating system. It's there, so why not use it?
It isn't built in, it's available to be installed to the hardware and lift the Windows environment up to a Dom0 status.
Different and not at all the same as "built in".
In my mind it is built-in as it's available for use once it's installed without having to head out somewhere to download something for the install. The changes made to the host OS are beside
sthe point IMNSHO. -
@PhlipElder said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Hyper-v is built-in to the Windows Desktop operating system. It's there, so why not use it?
I think that's the way to go when it exists. But didn't here.
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@PhlipElder said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@PhlipElder said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
Hyper-v is built-in to the Windows Desktop operating system. It's there, so why not use it?
It isn't built in, it's available to be installed to the hardware and lift the Windows environment up to a Dom0 status.
Different and not at all the same as "built in".
In my mind it is built-in as it's available for use once it's installed without having to head out somewhere to download something for the install. The changes made to the host OS are beside
sthe point IMNSHO.It's built in to the install and package. Just like LibreOffice is built in to Fedora. It's not part of the OS proper, and not included by default, but is ready to go and doesn't require anything else.
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@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
A guest is a guest. Are you asking if Windows on KVM acts like Windows with Hyper-V and a dom0 Windows?
Scott says Dom0 gets priority over other VMs - so no, a guest is not a guest, assuming he's right.
Don't mistaken heightened with priority.
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@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@DustinB3403 said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@scottalanmiller said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Dashrender said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
@Obsolesce said in VM Suggestions? Best Practice?:
I needed to do a ton of testing in many scenarios. The easiest and most efficient thing for me to do, being that I was running Win10 Pro, was to simply enable the built in Hyper-V, then install a few Win10 VMs of different versions , creating multiple checkpoints along the way for quickly going back to different points or places to test.
This worked extremely well for me. Doing it any other way would have been a total PITA.
Well - just to give credit to the KVM solution - it would be nearly if not identically easy to do that with KVM.
I thought he was running Win10 on his laptop.
Edit... But no, running Win10 VM on Hyper-V on Win10 is smooth AF. I use fedora Workstation on a laptop too with a Win10 VM, Win10 and Hyper-V is smoother.
OK - so you have some experience - what makes it smoother?
It's smoother because it puts Windows into the Dom0 and gives it heightened access. Same way that the base Fedora install with KVM is smoother than one of the guest Vms.
OK that explains Dom0,
So now I ask - are the other Windows VMs basically the same on KVM vs Hyper-V?
A guest is a guest. Are you asking if Windows on KVM acts like Windows with Hyper-V and a dom0 Windows?
Scott says Dom0 gets priority over other VMs - so no, a guest is not a guest, assuming he's right.
Don't mistaken heightened with priority.
I feel a piano intro coming on...
"a guest is not a guest, a sigh is just a sigh..." -
Let's consider a totally different option...
Install MeshCentral at work on your work desktop, and then use Linux (ChromeOS, Fedora, whatever) to remote into that, and then use Command Center from there
