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    ZeroTier Question

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    • J
      JaredBusch @dafyre
      last edited by

      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

      Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

      Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

      I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

      D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • D
        dafyre @JaredBusch
        last edited by

        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

        Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

        Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

        I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

        What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

        J 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • J
          JaredBusch @dafyre
          last edited by

          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

          @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

          Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

          Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

          I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

          What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

          Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

          D D 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • D
            Dashrender @JaredBusch
            last edited by

            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

            Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

            Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

            I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

            What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

            Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

            Ug.. did you just say NetBIOS?

            J 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
            • J
              JaredBusch @Dashrender
              last edited by

              @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

              @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

              @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

              @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

              @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

              Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

              Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

              I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

              What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

              Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

              Ug.. did you just say NetBIOS?

              Yes. That magic way that everything works on a LAN without DNS.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • D
                dafyre @JaredBusch
                last edited by

                @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                D J 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • D
                  Dashrender @dafyre
                  last edited by

                  @dafyre I too have found reliability to be a problem.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • D
                    dafyre
                    last edited by

                    Let's wait and hear back from @WLS-ITGuy before we go too far down the rabbit hole.

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • J
                      JaredBusch @dafyre
                      last edited by

                      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                      Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                      Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                      I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                      What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                      Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                      Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                      NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                      D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • D
                        dafyre @JaredBusch
                        last edited by dafyre

                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                        Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                        Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                        I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                        What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                        Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                        Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                        NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                        Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                        J scottalanmillerS 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • J
                          JaredBusch
                          last edited by

                          Anyway, as I linked at some point above and it was apparently not understood, i have zero problems access network resources over ZeroTier from this laptop. There is not any DNS setup. So that does mean that if the laptop never comes in the office, it will eventually lose trust with the server because domain.local does not resolve, only the machine names.

                          No I could easily fix that by adding a line to the hosts file with the ZeroTier IP of one of the domain controllers and the domain suffix like this:

                          10.202.3.21    domain.local
                          

                          Then even domain queries will work. But for machines that are on and off the network all the time, it is usually not needed as they get their tokens refreshed often enough.

                          Windows IP Configuration
                          
                             Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : dt-backup-laptop
                             Primary Dns Suffix  . . . . . . . : domain.local
                             Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Hybrid
                             IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
                             WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
                             DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : domain.local
                          
                          Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection 2:
                          
                             Connection-specific DNS Suffix  . :
                             Description . . . . . . . . . . . : ZeroTier One Virtual Port #2
                             Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : A2-E2-9D-9B-48-F1
                             DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No
                             Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
                             IPv6 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : fd56:5799:d8f6:3ed4:a199:9336:a36d:9068(P
                          referred)
                             Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::e023:2905:284a:b878%24(Preferred)
                             IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 10.202.3.188(Preferred)
                             Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
                             Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 25.255.255.254
                             DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 587267855
                             DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-19-2C-13-92-F0-1F-AF-13-7A-8E
                          
                             DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : fec0:0:0:ffff::1%1
                                                                 fec0:0:0:ffff::2%1
                                                                 fec0:0:0:ffff::3%1
                             NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled
                          
                          Wireless LAN adapter Wireless Network Connection:
                          
                             Connection-specific DNS Suffix  . :
                             Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Intel(R) Centrino(R) Advanced-N 6205
                             Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 6C-88-14-5A-B5-A0
                             DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
                             Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
                             Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::d90e:714e:228:aafb%12(Preferred)
                             IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.8(Preferred)
                             Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
                             Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Monday, May 09, 2016 7:43:00 PM
                             Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Wednesday, May 11, 2016 3:06:04 PM
                             Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                             DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                             DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 225216532
                             DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-19-2C-13-92-F0-1F-AF-13-7A-8E
                          
                             DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                             NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled
                          
                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • J
                            JaredBusch @dafyre
                            last edited by

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                            Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                            I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                            What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                            Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                            Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                            NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                            Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                            WTF? What problem? I just said it was reliable on ZeroTier.

                            scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • scottalanmillerS
                              scottalanmiller @dafyre
                              last edited by

                              @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                              @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

                              @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

                              @dafyre I got the onsite vs offsite part. However, shouldn't ZeroTier handle the offsite routing? Or is that not how this works 🙂

                              It's not about handling routing because there would be no route.

                              Example
                              Server internal wire network IP - 192.16.8.10
                              ________________________ZT IP - 10.0.50.10

                              If, when you're offsite, DNS returns the 192.16.8.10 address, the ZT network would never look at this traffic because it's not part of the ZT network. Instead that traffic would go to the normal NIC, wireless probably, and go out that way and of course fail.

                              And this is why I default to building a ZT Gateway. Yes, it is more work up front. Yes, it is slightly more complicated. However, it prevents you from having to deal with these types of issues.

                              In what way? If the wrong DNS is being grabbed, how does the extra complexity of the gateway make it easier?

                              D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • scottalanmillerS
                                scottalanmiller @dafyre
                                last edited by

                                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                                He meant that Pertino and ZeroTier are places where the IP does not change. Their addresses are stable. Unlike many traditional VPN services.

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • scottalanmillerS
                                  scottalanmiller @JaredBusch
                                  last edited by

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                  Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                  I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                  What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                  Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                  Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                  NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                  Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                                  WTF? What problem? I just said it was reliable on ZeroTier.

                                  I knew what you meant but after reading what he responded and reading your post again I figured out that the word order could be emphasized differently to make it sound like you were saying that they were an example of stable OR an example of unstable.

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • D
                                    dafyre @scottalanmiller
                                    last edited by dafyre

                                    @scottalanmiller said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @dafyre I got the onsite vs offsite part. However, shouldn't ZeroTier handle the offsite routing? Or is that not how this works 🙂

                                    It's not about handling routing because there would be no route.

                                    Example
                                    Server internal wire network IP - 192.16.8.10
                                    ________________________ZT IP - 10.0.50.10

                                    If, when you're offsite, DNS returns the 192.16.8.10 address, the ZT network would never look at this traffic because it's not part of the ZT network. Instead that traffic would go to the normal NIC, wireless probably, and go out that way and of course fail.

                                    And this is why I default to building a ZT Gateway. Yes, it is more work up front. Yes, it is slightly more complicated. However, it prevents you from having to deal with these types of issues.

                                    In what way? If the wrong DNS is being grabbed, how does the extra complexity of the gateway make it easier?

                                    In essence the device becomes part of the physical lan...this means that you no longer have to install ZT on every device ... Only those that leave the office.

                                    Rather than having ZT IP space and LAN IP space... they become one single IP space. This means that the DNS server's won't have to randomly decide whether or not to give out a ZT IP, or a LAN IP... They only have one IP to give out... This is where the complexity pays for itself, to me. We don't have to do any fancy DNS hijacking like Pertino does.

                                    scottalanmillerS J 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • J
                                      JaredBusch
                                      last edited by

                                      All of the above said, it is best to setup DNS.

                                      But you have to be aware of what you are doing and the side effects it will have, as well as the extra work it will entail.

                                      D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                      • D
                                        dafyre @JaredBusch
                                        last edited by

                                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        All of the above said, it is best to setup DNS.

                                        But you have to be aware of what you are doing and the side effects it will have, as well as the extra work it will entail.

                                        ^ This, for sure.

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • scottalanmillerS
                                          scottalanmiller @dafyre
                                          last edited by

                                          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                          In essence the device becomes part of the physical lan...this means that you no longer have to install ZT on every device ... Only those that leave the office.

                                          Rather than having ZT IP space and LAN IP space... they become one single IP space. This means that the DNS server's won't have to randomly decide whether or not to give out a ZT IP, or a LAN IP... They only have one IP to give out... This is where the complexity pays for itself, to me. We don't have to do any fancy DNS hijacking like Pertino does.

                                          I see, because you are not layering IPs for the servers, only for some of the clients.

                                          D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                          • J
                                            JaredBusch @dafyre
                                            last edited by

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @scottalanmiller said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @dafyre I got the onsite vs offsite part. However, shouldn't ZeroTier handle the offsite routing? Or is that not how this works 🙂

                                            It's not about handling routing because there would be no route.

                                            Example
                                            Server internal wire network IP - 192.16.8.10
                                            ________________________ZT IP - 10.0.50.10

                                            If, when you're offsite, DNS returns the 192.16.8.10 address, the ZT network would never look at this traffic because it's not part of the ZT network. Instead that traffic would go to the normal NIC, wireless probably, and go out that way and of course fail.

                                            And this is why I default to building a ZT Gateway. Yes, it is more work up front. Yes, it is slightly more complicated. However, it prevents you from having to deal with these types of issues.

                                            In what way? If the wrong DNS is being grabbed, how does the extra complexity of the gateway make it easier?

                                            In essence the device becomes part of the physical lan...this means that you no longer have to install ZT on every device ... Only those that leave the office.

                                            Rather than having ZT IP space and LAN IP space... they become one single IP space. This means that the DNS server's won't have to randomly decide whether or not to give out a ZT IP, or a LAN IP... They only have one IP to give out.

                                            That is not being talked about anywhere in this thread. Why would you suddenly curve this into something like that.

                                            While it certainly is something that can be setup, let's not detract from the point at hand.

                                            D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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