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    ZeroTier Question

    IT Discussion
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    • D
      dafyre @WLS-ITGuy
      last edited by

      @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

      @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

      @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

      @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

      makes me wonder if the router at the coffee shop was taken over and is doing bad things...

      Was that IP obtained while at the coffee shop? or did I miss it and it was really someone at their home?

      This one is at home.

      What do they have for DNS servers at home? Their ISP? I've seen many ISPs (Cox does this) if you put in a bad address, you get redirected to a bad website request page hosted by Cox instead of getting an invalid domain name as you might rather have. They are trying to making things more understandable for consumers, sadly it just screws us instead.

      Have you home user change the DNS provided by their router (if possible) to Google's 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 and try again.

      I've got $1 that says I can name the ISP of the home user...

      (Pro tip: It's mine too).

      AT&T? Cause that is mine too and I think I got the same address 🙂

      Naw... I bet your home-user's ISP is Charter?

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • J
        JaredBusch @Dashrender
        last edited by gjacobse

        @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

        Except in the case of the end-user's machine not actually hitting the internal DNS, maybe?

        Sure, but if the user isn't hitting an internal DNS, where would that address come from at all? I would expect it to simply fail, or get a *.wls.wels.net reply back, which isn't happening when I ping, so no reason to believe that would be happening to the home user.

        F[moderated], I said it. It is coming from his primary DNS like it should.

        D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • D
          dafyre @JaredBusch
          last edited by gjacobse

          @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

          @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

          Except in the case of the end-user's machine not actually hitting the internal DNS, maybe?

          Sure, but if the user isn't hitting an internal DNS, where would that address come from at all? I would expect it to simply fail, or get a *.wls.wels.net reply back, which isn't happening when I ping, so no reason to believe that would be happening to the home user.

          F[moderated], I said it. It is coming from his primary DNS like it should.

          Most likely it is his ISP hijacking the bad DNS results and will show a search page if he were to use a web browser.

          D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
          • D
            Dashrender @dafyre
            last edited by gjacobse

            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

            @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

            Except in the case of the end-user's machine not actually hitting the internal DNS, maybe?

            Sure, but if the user isn't hitting an internal DNS, where would that address come from at all? I would expect it to simply fail, or get a *.wls.wels.net reply back, which isn't happening when I ping, so no reason to believe that would be happening to the home user.

            F[moderated], I said it. It is coming from his primary DNS like it should.

            Most likely it is his ISP hijacking the bad DNS results and will show a search page if he were to use a web browser.

            I concur.

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • D
              Dashrender @JaredBusch
              last edited by

              @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

              @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

              I've got $1 that says I can name the ISP of the home user...

              (Pro tip: It's mine too).

              Not a secret. it is listed right in the screenshot.

              0_1462912306630_upload-3a350526-8c36-4bb2-8f7c-2e854408c0a3

              lol, nice scrolling 🙂

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
              • D
                dafyre
                last edited by

                Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                J 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • J
                  JaredBusch @dafyre
                  last edited by

                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                  Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                  Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                  I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                  D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • D
                    dafyre @JaredBusch
                    last edited by

                    @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                    @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                    Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                    Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                    I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                    What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                    J 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • J
                      JaredBusch @dafyre
                      last edited by

                      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                      @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                      Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                      Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                      I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                      What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                      Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                      D D 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • D
                        Dashrender @JaredBusch
                        last edited by

                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                        Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                        Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                        I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                        What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                        Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                        Ug.. did you just say NetBIOS?

                        J 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • J
                          JaredBusch @Dashrender
                          last edited by

                          @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

                          @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                          @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                          Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                          Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                          I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                          What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                          Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                          Ug.. did you just say NetBIOS?

                          Yes. That magic way that everything works on a LAN without DNS.

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • D
                            dafyre @JaredBusch
                            last edited by

                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                            Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                            Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                            I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                            What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                            Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                            Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                            D J 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • D
                              Dashrender @dafyre
                              last edited by

                              @dafyre I too have found reliability to be a problem.

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • D
                                dafyre
                                last edited by

                                Let's wait and hear back from @WLS-ITGuy before we go too far down the rabbit hole.

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • J
                                  JaredBusch @dafyre
                                  last edited by

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                  Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                  Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                  I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                  What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                  Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                  Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                  NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                  D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • D
                                    dafyre @JaredBusch
                                    last edited by dafyre

                                    @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                    Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                    Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                    I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                    What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                    Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                    Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                    NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                    Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                                    J scottalanmillerS 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • J
                                      JaredBusch
                                      last edited by

                                      Anyway, as I linked at some point above and it was apparently not understood, i have zero problems access network resources over ZeroTier from this laptop. There is not any DNS setup. So that does mean that if the laptop never comes in the office, it will eventually lose trust with the server because domain.local does not resolve, only the machine names.

                                      No I could easily fix that by adding a line to the hosts file with the ZeroTier IP of one of the domain controllers and the domain suffix like this:

                                      10.202.3.21    domain.local
                                      

                                      Then even domain queries will work. But for machines that are on and off the network all the time, it is usually not needed as they get their tokens refreshed often enough.

                                      Windows IP Configuration
                                      
                                         Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : dt-backup-laptop
                                         Primary Dns Suffix  . . . . . . . : domain.local
                                         Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Hybrid
                                         IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
                                         WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
                                         DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : domain.local
                                      
                                      Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection 2:
                                      
                                         Connection-specific DNS Suffix  . :
                                         Description . . . . . . . . . . . : ZeroTier One Virtual Port #2
                                         Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : A2-E2-9D-9B-48-F1
                                         DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : No
                                         Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
                                         IPv6 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : fd56:5799:d8f6:3ed4:a199:9336:a36d:9068(P
                                      referred)
                                         Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::e023:2905:284a:b878%24(Preferred)
                                         IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 10.202.3.188(Preferred)
                                         Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
                                         Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 25.255.255.254
                                         DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 587267855
                                         DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-19-2C-13-92-F0-1F-AF-13-7A-8E
                                      
                                         DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : fec0:0:0:ffff::1%1
                                                                             fec0:0:0:ffff::2%1
                                                                             fec0:0:0:ffff::3%1
                                         NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled
                                      
                                      Wireless LAN adapter Wireless Network Connection:
                                      
                                         Connection-specific DNS Suffix  . :
                                         Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Intel(R) Centrino(R) Advanced-N 6205
                                         Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 6C-88-14-5A-B5-A0
                                         DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
                                         Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
                                         Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::d90e:714e:228:aafb%12(Preferred)
                                         IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.8(Preferred)
                                         Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
                                         Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Monday, May 09, 2016 7:43:00 PM
                                         Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Wednesday, May 11, 2016 3:06:04 PM
                                         Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                                         DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                                         DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 225216532
                                         DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-19-2C-13-92-F0-1F-AF-13-7A-8E
                                      
                                         DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.1.1
                                         NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled
                                      
                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • J
                                        JaredBusch @dafyre
                                        last edited by

                                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                        Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                        Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                        I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                        What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                        Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                        Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                        NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                        Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                                        WTF? What problem? I just said it was reliable on ZeroTier.

                                        scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • scottalanmillerS
                                          scottalanmiller @dafyre
                                          last edited by

                                          @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                          @Dashrender said in ZeroTier Question:

                                          @WLS-ITGuy said in ZeroTier Question:

                                          @dafyre I got the onsite vs offsite part. However, shouldn't ZeroTier handle the offsite routing? Or is that not how this works 🙂

                                          It's not about handling routing because there would be no route.

                                          Example
                                          Server internal wire network IP - 192.16.8.10
                                          ________________________ZT IP - 10.0.50.10

                                          If, when you're offsite, DNS returns the 192.16.8.10 address, the ZT network would never look at this traffic because it's not part of the ZT network. Instead that traffic would go to the normal NIC, wireless probably, and go out that way and of course fail.

                                          And this is why I default to building a ZT Gateway. Yes, it is more work up front. Yes, it is slightly more complicated. However, it prevents you from having to deal with these types of issues.

                                          In what way? If the wrong DNS is being grabbed, how does the extra complexity of the gateway make it easier?

                                          D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • scottalanmillerS
                                            scottalanmiller @dafyre
                                            last edited by

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @JaredBusch said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            @dafyre said in ZeroTier Question:

                                            Connect him up via ZeroTier, and set your DNS Server's ZT IP on the zt Nic, and you should be good to go.

                                            Why. You keep saying this and I keep telling you that it is a bad idea.

                                            I have ZeroTier running and it resolves ZeroTier IP addresses with no DNS modifications.

                                            What are you using to do that? Your windows AD DNS?

                                            Nothing. ZeroTier passes NetBIOS. This is really basic.

                                            Yes it does. In my experience, over VPN type techs (like Pertino, ZT, OpenVPN, etc), Netbios has not been reliable.

                                            NetBIOS is reliable when addresses don't change like with Pertino and ZeroTier.

                                            Therein lies our problem.. He wants to use ZeroTier. 😄

                                            He meant that Pertino and ZeroTier are places where the IP does not change. Their addresses are stable. Unlike many traditional VPN services.

                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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