Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be
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Make sure you did absolutely everything within the local employment code/law - proper notice time, everything documented and the management signed off on.
I had exactly one horrid employer in my life. When I found a way to leave, I did everything by the book, with a checklist, because I knew they sued everyone who left them, every time.
When I left, my friends at the office told me they were meeting with a lawyer the very same day. Nothing came of it, because I didn't give them anything to base a lawsuit on, but the fact that they tried remains.
As a bonus, I found out they lost 3 of their largest customers (~$4.5M/year) as soon as I left.
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
Make sure you did absolutely everything within the local employment code/law - proper notice time, everything documented and the management signed off on.
I had exactly one horrid employer in my life. When I found a way to leave, I did everything by the book, with a checklist, because I knew they sued everyone who left them, every time.
When I left, my friends at the office told me they were meeting with a lawyer the very same day. Nothing came of it, because I didn't give them anything to base a lawsuit on, but the fact that they tried remains.
As a bonus, I found out they lost 3 of their largest customers (~$4.5M/year) as soon as I left.
He is a regular employee without any specific contract. There is nothing to do except walk out the door.
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@JaredBusch said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
He is a regular employee without any specific contract. There is nothing to do except walk out the door.
There's usually the local employment code dictated by the state/province/etc. All disputes are typically regulated according to that, superseded only by whatever additional terms are mentioned in a signed contract. If there is no contract, there's only the law. If there is no contract, an employee (and employer) are still in an employment relationship, governed by that law.
Typically it's that law that states you need to give X weeks of notice, and the same law that protects the employee from not getting paid for those weeks.
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
Typically it's that law that states you need to give X weeks of notice, and the same law that protects the employee from not getting paid for those weeks.
Not in states that are "employment at will". Plus he has no contract. He could've just walked without discussing with anyone and never showed up again.
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@DustinB3403 so he walks out the door, and the employer refuses to pay what is owed for the last month. And there is no regulation for such a case? Damn, I wouldn't want to live in a place where this is the norm.
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 so he walks out the door, and the employer refuses to pay what is owed for the last month. And there is no regulation for such a case? Damn, I wouldn't want to live in a place where this is the norm.
No. . .
But he can walk and gets paid for what he'd worked.
Who said anything about him not being paid for the time he's already worked?
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@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
No. . .
But he can walk and gets paid for what he'd worked.
Who said anything about him not being paid for the time he's already worked?
If there is no regulation, who enforces the employer to pay?
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@Pete-S said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
When you work long enough in the same place, you start to think that you are responsible for it all. You know management don't have a clue. It's your systems that you manage. It's your solutions they are using. In reality, it's not.
It's their systems and they gave you money in exchange for your time. You are even with your employer each time you get paid. They invested money, you invested a piece of your life. Time you will never get back. That is the deal.
You have no responsibility for anything, except to do your job while you are getting paid. That is what being an employee is - a trade.
This is the problem you are having. You are confused about what the deal is and what your part is. Not who said what or what is reasonable, legal or whatever. But it's normal. It's why people become suffer from occupational burnout. Now you just have realize it.
Well said.
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
No. . .
But he can walk and gets paid for what he'd worked.
Who said anything about him not being paid for the time he's already worked?
If there is no regulation, who enforces the employer to pay?
The laws. . .
But there is no law that states you are forced to provide a certain amount of notice in "Employment at will" states. You can leave, fired or let go at any time without notice.
That is not the same law as being required to pay employees for time worked.
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@DustinB3403 I see. And there is no compensation involved? Some countries I worked in, if you are sacked, you get compensation, but if you decide to leave, you get nothing
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 I see. And there is no compensation involved? Some countries I worked in, if you are sacked, you get compensation, but if you decide to leave, you get nothing
There could be, usually those are written into a contract. But those benefits do not always exist.
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@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
There could be, usually those are written into a contract. But those benefits do not always exist.
Guess I've been terribly spoiled by good conditions throughout my career then
I've only realised not all companies hand out company vehicles to all employees on my 16th year in IT -
@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 I see. And there is no compensation involved? Some countries I worked in, if you are sacked, you get compensation, but if you decide to leave, you get nothing
In the UK it depends. If you are sacked due to gross misconduct you wont get any money. If you are made redundant, you will get a set amount based on length of employment (could be more, but by law its at least that set amount), and if you take voluntary redundancy, you get a package as setup by the former employer... so, it depends.
If you signed a contract for 3 months notice, usually you can negotiate to leave early if you really want. "Im going to give two months". But, if you just walk out you didnt mean your contractual obligations and that could have ramifications.
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@Jimmy9008 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
In the UK it depends. If you are sacked due to gross misconduct you wont get any money. If you are made redundant, you will get a set amount based on length of employment (could be more, but by law its at least that set amount), and if you take voluntary redundancy, you get a package as setup by the former employer... so, it depends.
If you signed a contract for 3 months notice, usually you can negotiate to leave early if you really want. "Im going to give two months". But, if you just walk out you didnt mean your contractual obligations and that could have ramifications.
That's more what I'm used to seeing!
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What @Jimmy9008 posted and you @dyasny are used to seeing are "Contract Employees" in the US.
You're hired to work <usually some set length of time> and will be paid X with these benefits and these Exit options.
A normal hire in the US is, you're hired Fulltime/Parttime at X/hour(or salary) and work until you either quit or are terminated.
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@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 so he walks out the door, and the employer refuses to pay what is owed for the last month. And there is no regulation for such a case? Damn, I wouldn't want to live in a place where this is the norm.
Of course they still owe him for any time worked. Him walking out the door/quitting has nothing to do with that. Sure they could make him sue them over it, but then he could likely go after some damages as well, I would assume that wouldn't be worth it to the company - just pay him and let him go.
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@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@guyinpv said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
And all I wanted to do was open up a conversation so they could start looking for a replacement. I wasn't expecting a circus.What were you realistically expecting?
I think he was hoping for a "risk mitigation plan" but presented it incorrectly. What would have been good would have been a discussion without the idea of him leaving but a "I'm in a key man position because my boss isn't capable of doing her or my jobs, so we need to talk about how we are going to fix the risk of me getting hit by a bus." Present it that way and you are just doing your IT job. Talk about planning to leave and that's something they can pressure you out of or blame you for, but they can't stop you or blame you for getting killed.
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@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@dyasny said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
@DustinB3403 I see. And there is no compensation involved? Some countries I worked in, if you are sacked, you get compensation, but if you decide to leave, you get nothing
There could be, usually those are written into a contract. But those benefits do not always exist.
Let's restate that - in the US, those benefits rarely exist, at least directly from the company. The person can file unemployment with the state, but that's a whole different ball game.
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@Jimmy9008 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
Your mistake was trying to be nice. Learn from that. Next time, resign after finding a new role, tell them when you are going.
This was made harder by the fact that he is already in that new role and has been transitioning out.
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@DustinB3403 said in Finally leaving my job, and it's just as annoying as I thought it would be:
What @Jimmy9008 posted and you @dyasny are used to seeing are "Contract Employees" in the US.
You're hired to work <usually some set length of time> and will be paid X with these benefits and these Exit options.
A normal hire in the US is, you're hired Fulltime/Parttime at X/hour(or salary) and work until you either quit or are terminated.
I don't think we have that in the UK. I guess zero hour contracts perhaps, but even then it is still slightly different. Every contract I have ever seen (even delivery driver for a Pizza joint) are all "Contract Employees" as you put it.
