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    Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice

    SAM-SD
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    • scottalanmillerS
      scottalanmiller @markl
      last edited by

      @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

      How does it's use change your thinking on build specs and setup? Do you use different RAID options?

      Production data tends to be on RAID 10, archival and backup data on RAID 6 (or RAID 7 in rare cases.) RAID 6 is less safe and less performant than RAID 10, but for backups this is normally of trivial concern. The speed of taking the backup is not normally a huge deal (especially if it is a remote backup) and the speed loss on RAID 6 is all in the writes, not in the reads, so a RAID 6 will restore just as fast as a RAID 10. RAID 6 is riskier, but that doesn't mean risky. Just not "as safe."

      The big reasons you would go to RAID 10 here over RAID 6 is that RAID 6 can experience extreme periods of unavailability during a recovery from a drive loss. If you have one drive fail and you replace it, you won't go "down" and you won't lose data, but your system might be effectively offline or slow to the point of useless while it recovers. This can last for days or even weeks. So if your system having that risk is of concern you would lean to RAID 10. But that's only in the situation where you have been saved from a disk failure, so often you put up with some inconvenience during this time because the RAID has already saved your bacon.

      RAID 10 with 8 bays (or any size) you lose 50% of your disk capacity.
      RAID 6 with 8 drives you lose 25% of your disk capacity. So in this case, your total usable size would be 50% larger with RAID 6 than with RAID 10.

      If you went to a larger array, like 10 or 12 disks, RAID 6 gets riskier, but the wasted space gets smaller.

      marklM 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • marklM
        markl @scottalanmiller
        last edited by

        @scottalanmiller wow, even in that explanation is seems like RAID 10 over RAID 6... except I suppose because you can better leverage your total diskspace. Is that the primary motivation?

        So to summarize:
        RAID 6 = Good backup solution due to higher use of available disks in the array (although consider 10 depending on the size of the array... larger array pushes you to RAID 10)
        RAID 10 = Good for production use -- high availability... faster disk failure recovery, etc...
        RAID 0 = For total high performance (we leverage this in our business for specific uses)... requires duplicate array for any form of redundancy/availability...

        scottalanmillerS 3 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • scottalanmillerS
          scottalanmiller @markl
          last edited by

          @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

          @scottalanmiller wow, even in that explanation is seems like RAID 10 over RAID 6... except I suppose because you can better leverage your total diskspace. Is that the primary motivation?

          Correct, the sole motivation for RAID 6 is that you can get more capacity at lower cost and quite often, that is a really big motivator. Speed and reliability, once you have "enough" might not be worth losing additional money over. And with moderately sized arrays, the capacity benefits of RAID 6 can be quite significant. Like in a 12 disk array.

          wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • scottalanmillerS
            scottalanmiller @markl
            last edited by

            @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

            So to summarize:
            RAID 6 = Good backup solution due to higher use of available disks in the array (although consider 10 depending on the size of the array... larger array pushes you to RAID 10)
            RAID 10 = Good for production use -- high availability... faster disk failure recovery, etc...

            Some additional high level guidelines...

            http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/03/practical-raid-choices-for-spindle-based-arrays/
            http://www.smbitjournal.com/2012/11/choosing-a-raid-level-by-drive-count/

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • scottalanmillerS
              scottalanmiller @markl
              last edited by

              @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

              RAID 0 = For total high performance (we leverage this in our business for specific uses)... requires duplicate array for any form of redundancy/availability...

              If you have a duplicate array, then it's really RAID 01.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
              • wirestyle22W
                wirestyle22 @scottalanmiller
                last edited by wirestyle22

                @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                @scottalanmiller wow, even in that explanation is seems like RAID 10 over RAID 6... except I suppose because you can better leverage your total diskspace. Is that the primary motivation?

                Correct, the sole motivation for RAID 6 is that you can get more capacity at lower cost and quite often, that is a really big motivator. Speed and reliability, once you have "enough" might not be worth losing additional money over. And with moderately sized arrays, the capacity benefits of RAID 6 can be quite significant. Like in a 12 disk array.

                In what scenario would you personally use a raid 6 @scottalanmiller? Double parity is a huge penalty for cheap redundancy. Low capacity low iops server that only sort of matters?

                scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • scottalanmillerS
                  scottalanmiller @wirestyle22
                  last edited by

                  @wirestyle22 said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                  @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                  @markl said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                  @scottalanmiller wow, even in that explanation is seems like RAID 10 over RAID 6... except I suppose because you can better leverage your total diskspace. Is that the primary motivation?

                  Correct, the sole motivation for RAID 6 is that you can get more capacity at lower cost and quite often, that is a really big motivator. Speed and reliability, once you have "enough" might not be worth losing additional money over. And with moderately sized arrays, the capacity benefits of RAID 6 can be quite significant. Like in a 12 disk array.

                  In what scenario would you personally use a raid 6 @scottalanmiller? Double parity is a huge penalty for cheap redundancy. Low capacity low iops server that only sort of matters?

                  Any scenario where it meets the minimum requirement and the driver is lowering the cost of capacity. I'd almost always use it in backup and archival storage where I've not moved on to RAIN.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • gjacobseG
                    gjacobse
                    last edited by gjacobse

                    The Netgear ReadyNAS line has three desktop models that will take eight drives- I don't know if this would help any..

                    • RN628X - 130tb
                    • RN528X - 130tb
                    • RN428 - 80tb

                    I have a ReadyNAS 4 bay, runs great, little maintenance - thought I suppose I could / should do more with it. It mainly just sits as I am slow working on the project of moving my media over to it.

                    scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • scottalanmillerS
                      scottalanmiller @gjacobse
                      last edited by

                      @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                      RN628X

                      Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                      gjacobseG coliverC 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
                      • gjacobseG
                        gjacobse @scottalanmiller
                        last edited by

                        @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                        @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                        RN628X

                        Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                        Good point

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • coliverC
                          coliver @scottalanmiller
                          last edited by

                          @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                          @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                          RN628X

                          Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                          I just did a quick Xbyte for this. Really beefy processors (for the class) plus 6TB usable RAID 10 array for $3,000.

                          scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • scottalanmillerS
                            scottalanmiller @coliver
                            last edited by

                            @coliver said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                            @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                            @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                            RN628X

                            Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                            I just did a quick Xbyte for this. Really beefy processors (for the class) plus 6TB usable RAID 10 array for $3,000.

                            With SAS drives?

                            coliverC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • scottalanmillerS
                              scottalanmiller
                              last edited by

                              You don't need really beefy processors nor dual processors. Look at smaller, single procs.

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • coliverC
                                coliver @scottalanmiller
                                last edited by

                                @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                @coliver said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                RN628X

                                Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                                I just did a quick Xbyte for this. Really beefy processors (for the class) plus 6TB usable RAID 10 array for $3,000.

                                With SAS drives?

                                No, SATA. SAS would have bumped up the price a bit.

                                scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • scottalanmillerS
                                  scottalanmiller @coliver
                                  last edited by

                                  @coliver said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                  @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                  @coliver said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                  @scottalanmiller said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                  @gjacobse said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                  RN628X

                                  Diskless, that unit is $2,082.27. That's limited to eight bays. Going with an enterprise server, like an R510, would be under half that price with far more power and flexibility. And not limited to SATA.

                                  I just did a quick Xbyte for this. Really beefy processors (for the class) plus 6TB usable RAID 10 array for $3,000.

                                  With SAS drives?

                                  No, SATA. SAS would have bumped up the price a bit.

                                  That's odd. normally it's the same or cheaper.

                                  black3dynamiteB 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • black3dynamiteB
                                    black3dynamite @scottalanmiller
                                    last edited by

                                    @scottalanmiller
                                    If @markl decides to use a server like R510, would you recommend installing a hypervisor and then setup a VM has a NAS server?

                                    coliverC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • coliverC
                                      coliver @black3dynamite
                                      last edited by

                                      @black3dynamite said in Project: Home/SMB NAS Setup -- Need ur advice:

                                      @scottalanmiller
                                      If @markl decides to use a server like R510, would you recommend installing a hypervisor and then setup a VM has a NAS server?

                                      Always virtualize. This isn't a special case.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                      • scottalanmillerS
                                        scottalanmiller
                                        last edited by

                                        Virtual. And I think I mentioned that buried in one of my posts about it. Or maybe it was the other thread that this split off of.

                                        KVM, Xen or Hyper-V all work great here. Physical wouldn't be horrible, but no need for it.

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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