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    I did a thing, have a quick Linux question

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved IT Discussion
    linuxxenxenserverhyper-vkvm
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    • S
      Sparkum @DustinB3403
      last edited by

      @DustinB3403

      Well what are we talking here, for me it would be (atleast) 3 2TB drives, so you are saying make 1 giant 6TB raid 0 correct?

      So 1 drive dies I lose 6TB

      Or are you saying make 3 2TB Raid 0's so that if I lose 1 I only lose 2TB
      Can I then make it appear to be one disk though?

      And please keep in mind there might just not be a linux thing I dont know.

      For example in Windows I have stablebit drive pool pooling my drives so that if I lose 1 drive I only lose the data on that one drive.

      wirestyle22W DustinB3403D 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • S
        Sparkum @wirestyle22
        last edited by

        @wirestyle22

        Total (used and unused) I'm sitting at 22TB.

        And I'd say I'm expanding fast enough that I felt I needed 22TB, have 6TB free, had prob 12TB+ free 6 months ago.

        Offloading some junk to the cloud though currently.

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • wirestyle22W
          wirestyle22 @Sparkum
          last edited by

          @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

          @DustinB3403

          Well what are we talking here, for me it would be (atleast) 3 2TB drives, so you are saying make 1 giant 6TB raid 0 correct?

          So 1 drive dies I lose 6TB

          Or are you saying make 3 2TB Raid 0's so that if I lose 1 I only lose 2TB
          Can I then make it appear to be one disk though?

          And please keep in mind there might just not be a linux thing I dont know.

          For example in Windows I have stablebit drive pool pooling my drives so that if I lose 1 drive I only lose the data on that one drive.

          My thought was if you have 2TB you can't lose out of 10, put everything in a raid 0 and then buy a small NAS backup for the 2 TB.

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • DustinB3403D
            DustinB3403 @Sparkum
            last edited by

            @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

            @DustinB3403

            Well what are we talking here, for me it would be (atleast) 3 2TB drives, so you are saying make 1 giant 6TB raid 0 correct?

            So 1 drive dies I lose 6TB

            Or are you saying make 3 2TB Raid 0's so that if I lose 1 I only lose 2TB
            Can I then make it appear to be one disk though?

            And please keep in mind there might just not be a linux thing I dont know.

            For example in Windows I have stablebit drive pool pooling my drives so that if I lose 1 drive I only lose the data on that one drive.

            I'm just trying to understand what you are trying to do.

            Without RAID, you won't be able to present multiple disks to any OS (unless it's FakeRAID and Windows) and show it as one drive.

            S 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • S
              Sparkum @DustinB3403
              last edited by

              @DustinB3403

              My initial question was, is there a way to group harddrives in a non raid format. So yes, a fakeraid

              DustinB3403D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • DustinB3403D
                DustinB3403 @Sparkum
                last edited by

                @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                @DustinB3403

                My initial question was, is there a way to group harddrives in a non raid format. So yes, a fakeraid

                There is, and FakeRAID is about as useful as RAID0 (if you want to protect the data).

                Simply don't use it.

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • S
                  Sparkum @DustinB3403
                  last edited by

                  @DustinB3403

                  And maybe this is just me going from Windows to Linux, I admittedly don't know anything about how harddrives work in Linux

                  wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • dafyreD
                    dafyre
                    last edited by

                    I'd do RAID1, or RAID 6... I've only got ~3TB of data, but only 2 x 3TB drives (one of them is my backup drive at the moment).

                    If I don't have a real RAID controller, I'd use mdadm for Linux. I've used it in the past, and it worked very well.

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • wirestyle22W
                      wirestyle22 @Sparkum
                      last edited by

                      @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                      @DustinB3403

                      And maybe this is just me going from Windows to Linux, I admittedly don't know anything about how harddrives work in Linux

                      The thing to know is that software raid is totally unreliable in windows and very reliable in linux

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                      • DustinB3403D
                        DustinB3403
                        last edited by

                        And FakeRAID in linux will (every time) show you all of the drives. It will not present a single disk to you. It will show all of the disks in the "array" as individual disks. Because FakeRAID is dangerous and linux makes that very clear.

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                        • wirestyle22W
                          wirestyle22
                          last edited by wirestyle22

                          I'm making an assumption right now because I think I pretty much understand the way pooling works in relation to HD IOPS and I'm highly doubting you get any of the real benefit of a raid doing it that way--at least speed wise. Hypothetical scenario:

                          You create a software raid in ZFS with 4 hard drives in pool1. let's say 1200 IOPS total for this pool.
                          Later you add 4 hard drives to that raid but it's added in pool2. Each pool is 1200 IOPS, not 2400 IOPS.

                          FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                          scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • scottalanmillerS
                            scottalanmiller @wirestyle22
                            last edited by

                            @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                            FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                            FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                            wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • wirestyle22W
                              wirestyle22 @scottalanmiller
                              last edited by wirestyle22

                              @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                              @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                              FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                              FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                              Glad to be wrong about the raid portion of it but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                              dafyreD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • dafyreD
                                dafyre @wirestyle22
                                last edited by

                                @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                                FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                                Glad to be wrong but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                                Raid 0, I see very very very few cases where it'd be useful... But on a real raid controller, you can do hot spares for raid 1.

                                wirestyle22W 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • wirestyle22W
                                  wirestyle22 @dafyre
                                  last edited by wirestyle22

                                  @dafyre said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                  @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                  @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                  @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                  FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                                  FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                                  Glad to be wrong but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                                  Raid 0, I see very very very few cases where it'd be useful... But on a real raid controller, you can do hot spares for raid 1.

                                  On a real controller yeah but we are talking about FakeRAID.

                                  dafyreD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • dafyreD
                                    dafyre @wirestyle22
                                    last edited by

                                    @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                    @dafyre said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                    @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                    @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                    @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                    FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                                    FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                                    Glad to be wrong but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                                    Raid 0, I see very very very few cases where it'd be useful... But on a real raid controller, you can do hot spares for raid 1.

                                    On a real controller yeah but we are talking about FakeRAID.

                                    True. The need for a hot spare is not quite as critical in RAID 1 as it would be in RAID 5 or 6... Can the fakeRAID controllers do anything other than 1 and maybe 5?

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • stacksofplatesS
                                      stacksofplates @DustinB3403
                                      last edited by stacksofplates

                                      @DustinB3403 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                      @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                      @dafyre

                                      Are you able to group harddrives in a non raid format with linux?

                                      Like a stablebit drive pool for linux kind of thing?

                                      Versus making raid 0

                                      Why would you do this, when you could use MD Raid and have a highly resilient solution?

                                      Because if the drives are different sizes then you are limited to the size of the smallest drive in your array. With ZFS or Btrfs you can have different sized drives and the data span across all of them.

                                      wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                      • wirestyle22W
                                        wirestyle22 @dafyre
                                        last edited by

                                        @dafyre said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                        @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                        @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                        @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                        FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                                        FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                                        Glad to be wrong but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                                        Raid 0, I see very very very few cases where it'd be useful... But on a real raid controller, you can do hot spares for raid 1.

                                        SSD caching benefits greatly from Raid 0

                                        dafyreD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • dafyreD
                                          dafyre @wirestyle22
                                          last edited by

                                          @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                          @dafyre said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                          @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                          @scottalanmiller said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                          @wirestyle22 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                          FakeRAID is probably non-existent IOPS gains. It's like grouping for the sake of a label (I think). @JaredBusch could explain this better than I could though.

                                          FakeRAID has all the IOPS gains and the mirroring or redundancy. The Fake refers to the fact that it is built to trick you into think that it is hardware, when it is not. The RAID portion is real.

                                          Glad to be wrong but you can only Raid 0 or 1 with nothing nested and only whole disks. No hot spares and no hot swappable drives. I don't see why anyone would do it.

                                          Raid 0, I see very very very few cases where it'd be useful... But on a real raid controller, you can do hot spares for raid 1.

                                          SSD caching benefits greatly from Raid 0

                                          That falls under one of the few use cases where RAID 0 would be useful, lol.

                                          wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                          • wirestyle22W
                                            wirestyle22 @stacksofplates
                                            last edited by

                                            @stacksofplates said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                            @DustinB3403 said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                            @Sparkum said in I did a thing, have a quick Linux question:

                                            @dafyre

                                            Are you able to group harddrives in a non raid format with linux?

                                            Like a stablebit drive pool for linux kind of thing?

                                            Versus making raid 0

                                            Why would you do this, when you could use MD Raid and have a highly resilient solution?

                                            Because if the drives are different sizes then you are limited to the size of the smallest drive in your array. With ZFS or Btrfs you can have different sized drives and the data span across all of them.

                                            100% this.

                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
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