Exchange 365 Down?
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@wrx7m said:
@DustinB3403 said:
Summary, MS updated something on O365 Exchange that is no longer compatible with Exchange 2010 on premise, using the wizard broke our mail flow connector. I not being an exchange admin (nor office 365 admin) would have known where this issue was or how to fix it.
Exactly.... using the wizard broke our mail flow connector. The on site wizard broke it, not the change to O365.
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@scottalanmiller Ha! But first MS updated something on O365 Exchange that was incompatible with Exchange 2010. It was then followed by the tech running the wizard, which broke the on-premise side. Insult to injury performed by MS.
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@wrx7m said:
@scottalanmiller Ha! But first MS updated something on O365 Exchange that was incompatible with Exchange 2010.
You have no proof of that, because the correct troubleshooting steps were not taken. It could easily have been restarting the services or properly reauthenticating. We will never know because the tech broke it immediately.
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@JaredBusch said:
@wrx7m said:
@scottalanmiller Ha! But first MS updated something on O365 Exchange that was incompatible with Exchange 2010.
You have no proof of that, because the correct troubleshooting steps were not taken. It could easily have been restarting the services or properly reauthenticating. We will never know because the tech broke it immediately.
Right, the only thing that we are nearly sure of is that the tech broke something on the local side. Almost totally certain that this is all MS's fault based on what we know, but the fault of MS support (which we've had terrible experiences with in general ourselves so this follows on what we've seen first hand, but that's pretty anecdotal) but nothing here suggests any reason to think that the issue is in any way on the hosted side. Is there the possibility that it is? Yes, it is possible. Do we have any indicator to make us pin any blame there? No, not without more information and forensics. All of the known issues are on the local side (and caused by an MS tech working locally.)
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@scottalanmiller It's OK. I can't say that there is enough "evidence" that points exclusively to the on-premise side of things but I guess it doesn't matter. I am still planning on migrating to hosted Exchange.
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@wrx7m said:
@scottalanmiller It's OK. I can't say that there is enough "evidence" that points exclusively to the on-premise side of things but I guess it doesn't matter. I am still planning on migrating to hosted Exchange.
No, but in this case they stated that there was a break on the local side. We don't have the evidence ourselves, but the people involved pointed to it being a local issue. So what little we know is that it is an on premises problem. Is it possible that an on premises problems was covering up a hosted one too, of course. But we could suppose a lot of things break and get fixed that we don't know about. What is important is that we have no reason to suspect a break on the hosted side.
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What's also important is that people jump on these threads and see "issue with hosted" and start to assume that on premises never breaks and that hosted always breaks. But often the hosted issues are very isolated (we've had big outages, but limited to our account), are actually misreported local on premises issues (like here) or are just sensational and public when tons of companies have Exchange outages every day on premises but report it to no one. It all makes hosted look far more fragile than it is and on premises look far more reliable than it is.
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@scottalanmiller I can only go by what the OP said in his summary, which did indicate a change on the 365 side they claimed MS told them was the root cause and then was further borked by a tech that was in over his head.
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@wrx7m said:
@scottalanmiller I can only go by what the OP said in his summary, which did indicate a change on the 365 side they claimed MS told them was the root cause and then was further borked by a tech that was in over his head.
I read what he said as stating something quite different. I read it as saying that a change on the O365 side exposed a borked on premises install. That explains why we are seeing it differently.
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@scottalanmiller I agree we are seeing it differently. I still can't see your side after rereading it. LOL - Oh well, agree to disagree as some say.
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@scottalanmiller said:
What's also important is that people jump on these threads and see "issue with hosted" and start to assume that on premises never breaks and that hosted always breaks.
I wouldn't have thought so. Everything breaks. It would be a very naive IT bod who claims that on-premise never breaks. It's about which breaks the most, or which is more likely to break.
The best thing about hosted is that when it breaks it's normally someone else's fault, whereas when on-premise breaks it is usually my fault. And I always like the ability to deflect blame away from myself!
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@Carnival-Boy said:
@scottalanmiller said:
What's also important is that people jump on these threads and see "issue with hosted" and start to assume that on premises never breaks and that hosted always breaks.
I wouldn't have thought so. Everything breaks. It would be a very naive IT bod who claims that on-premise never breaks. It's about which breaks the most, or which is more likely to break.
The best thing about hosted is that when it breaks it's normally someone else's fault, whereas when on-premise breaks it is usually my fault. And I always like the ability to deflect blame away from myself!
Very true. But there is a sensational reaction to hosted. People expect it to break less (and stats suggest that that is true) but they also see any outage, quite often, as a bigger deal than an internal one. Lose your internal email for ten minutes in the middle of the night, no one mentions it or reports it internally or publicly. Do the same on O365 and it is headline news the next morning and everyone is talking about it.
People react to the two very differently and seem to view them in very skewed ways much of the time.
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@Carnival-Boy I agree. Nothing is 100% certain except failures will happen. Systems and services are much more reliable than they used to be but no matter where the system or service resides there can be a problem. Ideally, hosted services provide economies of scale that you can't get without huge expenditures, in-house, which usually mitigate a lot more risk and generate more reward.
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@scottalanmiller I would also say people have the same view of MS Windows updates. There have been several over the past couple of years that have really screwed some people. Just like a hosted outage can affect a large number of users, so can these updates. The main difference, for many, is they have a degree of control over when/if the updates are applied but is not necessarily true of hosted services. So when something breaks it tends to be more surprising because they weren't expecting a change.
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@wrx7m said:
@scottalanmiller I would also say people have the same view of MS Windows updates. There have been several over the past couple of years that have really screwed some people. Just like a hosted outage can affect a large number of users, so can these updates. The main difference, for many, is they have a degree of control over when/if the updates are applied but is not necessarily true of hosted services. So when something breaks it tends to be more surprising because they weren't expecting a change.
Yes, there is a bizarre, irrational reaction to very rare update problems.
