New Server Migration Adventure
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@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license. Add this to the Dev projects they push me on, I had had to juggle many things but also try to make the best decision I could.
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@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
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@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
Thanks for all of the tips thus far. I may have to rush this migration now...
I came into the office today with the oldest of the two physical servers sounding like jet airplanes taking off..before, it just sounded like a sick car. It could be days our hours before it may give it up. Not sure why the fans are running so high today but add that to some bad memory, failed drives (but still working RAID set)...it simply can't wait too much longer. I asked for this upgrade 6 months ago. But I digress.
I'd still like to take time and do the migration to 2016 rather than just moving the VM's...luckily the weekend is here (though I have to coach a few ball games this weekend.) But for sure don't want to rush this.
You are making a huge mistake by mixing the tasks. You new hardware can run everything twice or more, I would assume.
So just migrate the VMs to stable (I won't call it good) hardware that will not up and suddenly die (most likely).
Then, next weekend, worry about building Server 2016 and migrating roles.
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@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
Stop beating a dead horse.
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@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
Stop beating a dead horse.
It's not dead if he was unaware of it. If it was a dead horse, he'd have been aware of the issues.
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@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
Add this to the Dev projects they push me on, I had had to juggle many things but also try to make the best decision I could.
I realize this is now a post mortem situation, but I'd say that this is a really important time to take a moment and dig into decision making processes as this is, like any port mortem, an important learning exercise to look at how the process was done, what could be improved, where things went wrong, etc.
Some thoughts:
- You posted about having bought a VRTX and how to use it, but didn't post about considering buying one. We'd have stopped you instantly as it is a known "never for use in the SMB" product that has been heavily vetted for years. We could have sped up your decision process around that from months to seconds. It has been covered, as Jared pointed out, quite a lot. We have lots and lots of resources about it ready to go, both research and discussions. And in multiple communities.
- How did a VRTX or an IPOD get on your consideration list, why was it on the short list?
- Why did totally different solutions get put on the short list, but not normal ones (like hyperconvergence, stand alone servers, etc.?) While common solutions aren't for everyone, the standard approaches are generally worth at least a brief consideration if only as a comparison point or a "stick in the ground" so that you have a cost and complexity guideline to work against. In this case, you had two extremely disparate and non-standard solution paths that were very difficult to compare directly, and none of the ones more similar to either to see if those were good representatives of their "style".
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@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
Stop beating a dead horse.
It's not dead if he was unaware of it. If it was a dead horse, he'd have been aware of the issues.
The purchase is over and done. It is a dead horse.
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@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
Thanks for all of the tips thus far. I may have to rush this migration now...
I came into the office today with the oldest of the two physical servers sounding like jet airplanes taking off..before, it just sounded like a sick car. It could be days our hours before it may give it up. Not sure why the fans are running so high today but add that to some bad memory, failed drives (but still working RAID set)...it simply can't wait too much longer. I asked for this upgrade 6 months ago. But I digress.
I'd still like to take time and do the migration to 2016 rather than just moving the VM's...luckily the weekend is here (though I have to coach a few ball games this weekend.) But for sure don't want to rush this.
You are making a huge mistake by mixing the tasks. You new hardware can run everything twice or more, I would assume.
So just migrate the VMs to stable (I won't call it good) hardware that will not up and suddenly die (most likely).
Then, next weekend, worry about building Server 2016 and migrating roles.
Yes, given the new urgency, just migrate the workloads directly. Upgrade the OS level later.
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@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
Stop beating a dead horse.
It's not dead if he was unaware of it. If it was a dead horse, he'd have been aware of the issues.
The purchase is over and done. It is a dead horse.
Ah, that's very bad in IT. You never, ever skip learning from your decision processes. If you treat existing decisions as "over and done" that's how you end up not growing, and repeating those mistakes - where the mistake is the flawed decision making process. Few things are as important, especially in IT, as evaluating the decision process itself. What was missed, how did the decision end up looking viable, what resources were used or missed, etc.
This is vastly more important than the actual decision. Physical decisions are made once. Good or bad, it's a roll of the dice and that's over. But the decision process is what our careers are built on and something we do over and over again. That's where we grow and how we get better at what we do. In IT especially, we can only ever know so much, but we can improve the process by which we leverage knowledge greatly.
It's probably the most important thing that we do in IT, constantly going back with a critical eye to how we make decisions, and improving that process every time. Never skip that evaluation, that's 100x more important than the individual decisions.
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@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@scottalanmiller said in New Server Migration Adventure:
@garak0410 said in New Server Migration Adventure:
...not that makes it easier to migrate off of that one day but very glad to have it.
Your glad to have a VRTX inverted pyramid? Why? I'd think you'd be livid that someone bought that for your environment. Why are you not upset?
http://www.smbitjournal.com/2015/11/understanding-the-role-of-the-dell-vrtx/
I'd have to be upset at myself. I made the final decision after months of negotiating on cost and features. I really tried for a good R730 with Azure as our DR but they didn't want to pay the yearly license.
Why did you compare a VRTX with no DR against a cloud DR alone? Why not just a R730, or two R730? That's not an apples to oranges comparison with the single device VRTX.
Any why Azure for DR? Azure is, even within the cloud space, extremely expensive. You can do DR for a fraction of the cost without that annual fee.
But given that the result is not to have DR, the proper comparison would have been other "non-DR" solutions.
Stop beating a dead horse.
It's not dead if he was unaware of it. If it was a dead horse, he'd have been aware of the issues.
The purchase is over and done. It is a dead horse.
Ah, that's very bad in IT. You never, ever skip learning from your decision processes. If you treat existing decisions as "over and done" that's how you end up not growing, and repeating those mistakes - where the mistake is the flawed decision making process. Few things are as important, especially in IT, as evaluating the decision process itself. What was missed, how did the decision end up looking viable, what resources were used or missed, etc.
This is vastly more important than the actual decision. Physical decisions are made once. Good or bad, it's a roll of the dice and that's over. But the decision process is what our careers are built on and something we do over and over again. That's where we grow and how we get better at what we do. In IT especially, we can only ever know so much, but we can improve the process by which we leverage knowledge greatly.
It's probably the most important thing that we do in IT, constantly going back with a critical eye to how we make decisions, and improving that process every time. Never skip that evaluation, that's 100x more important than the individual decisions.
A postmortem of a process is a great tool to learn about your decisions. But you were beating this into the ground as if it was an active decision. It was not until your previous post that you began to treat it like a postmortem analysis.
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@jaredbusch said in New Server Migration Adventure:
A postmortem of a process is a great tool to learn about your decisions. But you were beating this into the ground as if it was an active decision. It was not until your previous post that you began to treat it like a postmortem analysis.
I didn't know at first that it was HIS decision. And there is always the chance of sending gear back, even once purchased, decisions are not necessarily final.
But look at the one before you said dead horse. I was asking about his process, how did his short list get made, etc. Definitely was looking at his process, not the final outcome.
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And, of course, we are just assuming that there aren't other factors involved that are unknowns that make the VRTX make sense where we might otherwise not thing about it. It's good for massive capacity in a small, quiet space, for example. We only know the most high level details here.
