Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
@scottalanmiller said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Lets say I needed to restore something... I'd first have to restore a huge VHD and VM to make the included NFS share available. Then I would be able to restore a piece of data from that NFS share.
That's really saying the same thing twice. You are restoring the one file, that's all. Yes it is large, but it is large regardless of where you put it.
No the VHD is like a big box. Inside that box contains another box (the NFS share).
In a DR scenario, I'd have to restore the big box, just to be able to get at the box inside of it, which then contains the data I want.
Right, same both ways. You aren't explaining to us the downsides of our approach. We are seeing everything negative that you say about Linux as applying to Hyper-V, and everything positive about Hyper-V applying to the Linux VM. We aren't seeing what aspect is making one better than the other, no negatives that we are finding in the VM approach (which is why it's considered the best practice here.)
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So you have Hyper-V host with NFS share - you back that up to tape - using what? There is no VM in this case, so you have to have some kind of agent that will run directly on Hyper-V.. that agent allows you to take file level backups.
So just use that same software, this time with a Windows Agent, install that agent inside the Windows VM, use that agent to backup to tape the files, not the VM (a good one might do both at the same time).
Then restore from tape just the file itself to the windows VM previously mentioned. Done, no restore of a whole VM on Hyper-V required. -
@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Doing it via VHD through a VM, I'd have to first restore the entire VHD which contains the entire NFS share from tape, which would contain the backups of all Linux servers... all before I can run the recover media and restore that single server.
It's the same amount of data. One is stored in a VHD, the other is stored in a file system. You wouldn't be able to restore the Linux machines without having the hypervisor up and the data back on the MD1000 anyway. That extra step seems so insignificant that it's not even worth thinking about.
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Doing it via VHD through a VM, I'd have to first restore the entire VHD which contains the entire NFS share from tape, which would contain the backups of all Linux servers... all before I can run the recover media and restore that single server.
So let's reword this...
Linux VM Way
You'd have to install Hyper-V, then restore a tiny VM (maybe 10GB or less) or do a built from Ansible or whatever. This is fast and painless no matter how it is handled. Super easy.
Then you'd need to restore the files you want to put back. You can restore only the ones you need to restore right away, then get the rest later.
Hyper-V Way
You'd have to restore Hyper-V, rather than do a plain install or else you'll need to have it backed up. This is also fast, but the same effort as the Linux VM above. No benefits yet.
Then you'd need to restore the files you want to put back. You can restore only the ones you need to restore right away, then get the rest later.
From what I can tell, they are effectively identical.
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I think Tim might believe that the only way to backup a VM on Hyper-V is by backing up the whole VHD. This is not the case. You can install an Agent inside the VM, and do file level backup just like you do a bare metal server.
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There is also the question of... what is the real concern here? That a server will fail, AND the backup server itself will completely fail, all at the same time? That's not an impossible situation, but it is crazy rare. Is that really the only situation that this even brings up concern for?
Certainly under normal backup system failure, you'd want to restore the whole thing before using it again, regardless of where you were storing it, right?
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Let me ask this way...
If I have a simple VM running a NFS share, and the NFS share is stored on a VHD on the Hyper-V host (MD1000)...
I have several physical linux servers (LinuxServ1 to LinuxServ10), backing themselves up to that NFS share (which is in that VHD).
The MD1000 is backed up to Tape, which means that VHD is now on Tape.
Now in a DR scenario, I need to restore LinuxServ3... how do I do that?
Here's how, I now need to restore that whole VHD from tape, which contains 9 other Linux server backups.
Had that NFS share not been on a VHD, I could have simply restore ONLY LinuxServ3 from tape. But because the backup of LinuxServ3 is in a VHD, I have to restore the whole VHD to get at it.
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I see the concern is that perhaps he wants to restore a server from a point that is no longer on the NFS, but there is a 1 yr old tape that does have the Linux backup on it (that was originally saved to the NFS share) and restore it...
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
The MD1000 is backed up to Tape, which means that VHD is now on Tape.
Why? Says who? you don't have to backup the VHD, you can backup the files inside the VHD directly if you rather.
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
The MD1000 is backed up to Tape, which means that VHD is now on Tape.
This is the break. This doesn't mean that. That's not how I would normally do it, and certainly not how I would do it if I had your concern.
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Here's how, I now need to restore that whole VHD from tape, which contains 9 other Linux server backups.
You only need to do this if you lost the VHD that was running on the Hyper-V host in the first place.
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@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Let me ask this way...
If I have a simple VM running a NFS share, and the NFS share is stored on a VHD on the Hyper-V host (MD1000)...
I have several physical linux servers (LinuxServ1 to LinuxServ10), backing themselves up to that NFS share (which is in that VHD).
The MD1000 is backed up to Tape, which means that VHD is now on Tape.
Now in a DR scenario, I need to restore LinuxServ3... how do I do that?
Here's how, I now need to restore that whole VHD from tape, which contains 9 other Linux server backups.
Had that NFS share not been on a VHD, I could have simply restore ONLY LinuxServ3 from tape. But because the backup of LinuxServ3 is in a VHD, I have to restore the whole VHD to get at it.
Why? Just backup the NFS share from the VM like you would the other way? Put an agent on the VM or use whatever tool you're using now to backup just the Linux servers backups.
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Basically, if you put the NFS on Hyper-V you know you are going to back it up file by file. Treat the Linux VM the same, problem solved.
Anything that works for Hyper-V, works just as well or better for the VM.
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@tim_g My question is why are you taking your boxes and making one really big box out of everything.
You have your VM's, your MD1000, your physical systems, why not back them up individually? This way you don't have to restore 100TB of of shit, if all you need is 10 gb worth of critical files immediately?
Why are you taking the entire MD1000 and backing that entire thing up to tape as a block device. Rather than doing individual file level backups to tape or cloud provider?
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Also worth asking, why back up to an NFS device in the middle just to go to the MD1000? Why not go directly to the MD1000 and bypass the middle man?
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@scottalanmiller said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Also worth asking, why back up to an NFS device in the middle just to go to the MD1000? Why not go directly to the MD1000 and bypass the middle man?
How do you do that over the network?
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@scottalanmiller said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Also worth asking, why back up to an NFS device in the middle just to go to the MD1000? Why not go directly to the MD1000 and bypass the middle man?
@scottalanmiller he is using the MD1000 as both VHD storage and backup medium. (IE Production drives and backup) and then wanting to backup the entire thing.
Almost IPOD in design. A few servers sitting out somewhere connecting back to the MD1000 to mount VHD's, and then have an NFS share on the same MD1000 to backup to.
And backup the entire MD1000 to protect the data, but not the servers.
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@scottalanmiller said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
@tim_g said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
The MD1000 is backed up to Tape, which means that VHD is now on Tape.
This is the break. This doesn't mean that. That's not how I would normally do it, and certainly not how I would do it if I had your concern.
The MD1000 only contains backups. The MD1000 is backed up as a whole to Tape, file by file.
If the NFS share is inside of a VHD, that whole VHD needs to be restored, rather than just the single "LinuxServ3" image file.
From within the simple Linux VM that is hosting the NFS share, I can't back that up to tape directly because the VM doesn't have access to the tape drive, and it woudl be a completely different backup in addition to the MD1000 being archived.
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What I don't follow is, if you are backing up to the MD1000, why not simply push that backup directly to tape or D2D2T even.
Why use the MD1000 as production disks and backup storage, and then push the entire box to tape?
Really seems like overkill.
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@dustinb3403 said in Create NFS file share on Hyper-V Server 2016:
Almost IPOD in design. A few servers sitting out somewhere connecting back to the MD1000 to mount VHD's, and then have an NFS share on the same MD1000 to backup to.
I might be wrong, but I think the only thing mounting the VHDs is the Hyper-V that the MD1000 is directly connected to.
