the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem
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So last december my company signed for a new ERP, so they wanted to buy a package generically described as "integration between VoIP phones and PC to get business info about the incoming call".
So I pointed out that, hell, we do NOT have VoIP in the company, how do you think to deal with this?
Answer: Let's see at the right time. (hint: that was the right time)fast-forward, today I've discovered that:
- the packege is instead a fully asterisk based custom PBX (namely an ESXI VA, hey we have just picked hyper-v, yuppy!)
- we have our own non VoIP analog (mostly UTP) phone system and PBX
- the two are of course in conflict and... the VoIP needs specific certified phone brands/models
- no, we do not have POE switches
me: "hey we do not need another PBX what do you want to do?"
answer: "let ditch current supplier and the whole equippement, including phones installed 6 month ago, and move to the new PBX, buy all the new phones make new cabling/switching, let the ERP provider manage our PBX"h.o.l.y.s.h.i.t
now the "cool-let-see-who-is-at-the-phone" feature is required by more or less 15 people into a 50 people company. Here around 40 between DECT and analog phones are deployed. also some phones runs over phone wiring not UTP.
to me this is an overkill solution in search of a problem.
my questions.
is there a way to let our PBX silently pass external calls to the new VoIP PBX and let this manage the internal lines dedicated to customer care?
is also possible to keep those lines able to forward the calls to other internal phones? Is this going to kill my dog?
we have an optic fiber connection which is then split into the rj45 data line (plug into the firewall), the rj45 fax line wiich is managed by a black box (to me) and provides 3 analog fax lines (on copper couples), the rj45 phone line which is managed by another black box and provides 4 UTP analog lines, those enter the PBX.
how the hell a virtual PBX fits in this!?!?!?!?! where do I put the plug? and which plug?
I would not throw away the entire stack and a trusted supplier just because the ERP feature is cool. Also I do not want an ERP provider to manage my lines...
any suggestion?! (no, job shift is planned for 2018).
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Wow. Just.... wow.
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What the.....
Who told you to buy this?!?! How was.... but....
brain explosion
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Just pay whatever the ERP vendor asks. The company has made their decisions.
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
Is this going to kill my dog?
Are you a shithead, because in my experience only shitheads kill your dog.
is there a way to let our PBX silently pass external calls to the new VoIP PBX and let this manage the internal lines dedicated to customer care?
Depends. What you got? Newer PRI based PBX? Old ass key system? One of those Avaya IP Office boxes? Definity? Aspect?
Easiest would be an IAX trunk. Next would be a T1 bridge across. Bad would be piping 20/30 analog lines over to a Rhino breakout box.
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@scottalanmiller said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
Just pay whatever the ERP vendor asks. The company has made their decisions.
This. They sound pretty clear about what they want to do and pretty clear that they don't want your advice or to include you in decision making. So why go to all the hassle of keeping your existing phone system when they've already told you to ditch it? You're setting yourself up to fail by that route. If you're already planning on leaving in 2018, just sit back and enjoy the ride for the next 12 months or so.
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@Carnival-Boy said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@scottalanmiller said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
Just pay whatever the ERP vendor asks. The company has made their decisions.
This. They sound pretty clear about what they want to do and pretty clear that they don't want your advice or to include you in decision making. So why go to all the hassle of keeping your existing phone system when they've already told you to ditch it? You're setting yourself up to fail by that route. If you're already planning on leaving in 2018, just sit back and enjoy the ride for the next 12 months or so.
Exactly. I'd look into having the ERP vendor do the phone setup too. No reason to risk getting it wrong, a little money there might make a lot of sense for a one time installation.
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@Carnival-Boy let say I'm curious, I'm really going to f*** off this company but at least I would like to understand if there was a solution to not destroy something just "because we can".
From another perspective: if a few seats require to switch to VoIP for a given theoretical service, do I need to convert the entire company to VoIP? is this just an all-or-nothing scenario?
My next job maybe would benefit from this knowledge. If they want they can f*** everything: its their money , but one goal of any job to me is to learn something new. asking to throw everything away can be ok. but I will learn nothing new (also because I will not configrure/deploy/provision anything).
Maybe I'm now just learning that you require an entire migration from analog UTP to VoIP, even for a single seat.
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
we have an optic fiber connection which is then split into the rj45 data line (plug into the firewall), the rj45 fax line wiich is managed by a black box (to me) and provides 3 analog fax lines (on copper couples), the rj45 phone line which is managed by another black box and provides 4 UTP analog lines, those enter the PBX.
how the hell a virtual PBX fits in this!?!?!?!?! where do I put the plug? and which plug?OK, just discovered that the ISP will reconfigure apparata and will plug another eth cable into the router, will plug it into another port of the firewall and will dismiss the eth to ISDN 4-line analog stuff. Killing the current setup.
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@PSX_Defector said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
Is this going to kill my dog?
Are you a shithead, because in my experience only shitheads kill your dog.
what kind? Some could fit!is there a way to let our PBX silently pass external calls to the new VoIP PBX and let this manage the internal lines dedicated to customer care?
Depends. What you got? Newer PRI based PBX? Old ass key system? One of those Avaya IP Office boxes? Definity? Aspect?
Easiest would be an IAX trunk. Next would be a T1 bridge across. Bad would be piping 20/30 analog lines over to a Rhino breakout box.
EDIT
posted the wrong italian link, fixed now.Neglecting current setup (ISDNx4) we have one of this Aastra 400 PBX (pdf), which, theoretically, can be reconfigured itself for VoIP.
New virtual PBX is asterisk based, this is the only info I have currently.
networking-wise, I will need to double the current order for POE+ switches. wiring could turn into nightmare... or not, depending on the phone solution (some phones can act as a small managed switch, you plug your pc in).
Negecting certifications for a little moment, what about VoIP converters like these?
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VoIP does not require PoE. PoE can be great of course, but you can use injectors wherever they make more sense.
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Essentially all phones have switched in them so you can essentially always do that. I can't think of an example if someone lacking that feature.
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@scottalanmiller of course, if a few phones will be moved to VoIP I will consider injectors, but if the entire network has to be redefined, POE+ switches turn to be cheaper and better manageable than ~40 local injectors.
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@scottalanmiller of course, if a few phones will be moved to VoIP I will consider injectors, but if the entire network has to be redefined, POE+ switches turn to be cheaper and better manageable than ~40 local injectors.
Yes, although it depends heavily on the phones that you choose. We used to buy phones that came with AC adapters in the box. So PoE was more expensive. These days, that is less and less common, but keep it in mind that the PoE might turn out to be purely an additional cost.
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@scottalanmiller thanks for the hint!
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@scottalanmiller of course, if a few phones will be moved to VoIP I will consider injectors, but if the entire network has to be redefined, POE+ switches turn to be cheaper and better manageable than ~40 local injectors.
If you need new switches this can be a good excuse to do it. But as much as I hate to admit it the adapters can be far cheaper
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@MattSpeller a number of new switches were in order, but if I have to revert ALL phones to LAN, well this more or less doubles our ports requirements, therefore the required switches.
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@MattSpeller a number of new switches were in order, but if I have to revert ALL phones to LAN, well this more or less doubles our ports requirements, therefore the required switches.
They do make phones with a built in switch, something to ponder perhaps. We have ancient Mitel phones that have a 100mb switch in them and they have been rock solid much to my surprise.
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@MattSpeller yes, this is another option too but batch in order had not so many POE ports and nowdays most phones has POE. Anyway still waiting for a compatibility list, maybe we can simply go the AC adapter way.
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@matteo-nunziati said in the missing VoIP, the ERP and the solution in search of a problem:
@MattSpeller yes, this is another option too but batch in order had not so many POE ports and nowdays most phones has POE. Anyway still waything for a compatibility list, maybe we can simply go the AC adapter way.
While it's still up in the air go check your network closet and make sure you have enough power to run enough PoE switches. This was the cause of an expensive visit from an electrician for us.
