Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions
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I'd love to know how this has boiled down, can someone TL;DR this 200 post saga for me?
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I cannot comment whether the package exists or not as I did not have the chance to look at Centos (in fact I run Kopano on debian as you know).
I pulled the tarball an hour ago, it's still missing.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
yes and the companies producing software, Kopano, video games, word processors, whatever.
Will spend their time and energy to produce packages for the most widely used operating system for one way or another.
I cannot be bothered to upgrade Fedora every 6 months nor Ubuntu every cycle therefore I stick with Centos and Ubuntu LTS whether it is entirely supported or partially or whatever.
It appears that a lot of people do this, hence that's why the vendors (or at least some of them) target these platforms.
I think by not upgrading when releases become available is leaving something on the table. What if upgrading gave you 10% more performance? would you do it then?
I think it's the job of us IT personal to keep our systems as up to date as possible. It's one of the massive advantages to using free software. I'm not saying you need to install it on the day it's released, but within a month doesn't seem unreasonable. That gives you a month to stand up a test environment and try it out, while also watching the forums for problems other people are having.
I know - I think I see the hitch. It's bloody well expensive to do this. And you know what, You're RIGHT! But IT isn't cheap. It never has been. But it's also core to many businesses, you wouldn't buy cheap tools if you're a mechanic, I hope. So why be cheap with your IT?
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I entirely disagree. Plenty of vendors still produced software for Windows XP although it was dead years ago.
The software you produce is for your customers, not for the beauty of it.
In Brasil cars run on ethanol, so you have to make engines for that.
Same.
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If it is still missing then perhaps you should have asked them why and when it will be fixed.
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If you are a bank you want the minimum change possible to keep going. That's how they function. I work in that environment and trust me Ubuntu 16.10 will be here in 2028
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@MattSpeller said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I'd love to know how this has boiled down, can someone TL;DR this 200 post saga for me?
Yes, and I'll do another thread of our findings. But it comes down to: Zimbra surprised us as the clear winner. Kopano just wasn't up to the job. But has nice features that we'd like to have, but don't need.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
If you are a bank you want the minimum change possible to keep going. That's how they function. I work in that environment and trust me Ubuntu 16.10 will be here in 2028
That's not a good bank. I've done my decade in banks and one thing the ones under my direction would never do is deploy things only supported for six months! Just not thing that banks with their change rates can do. They need long term supported products, so Ubuntu was always ruled out.
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As I said the community models are completely different, you cannot say one is better than the other, they are just different.
Everything in mainline branch (kopano)
Same release as prod but no advanced features (Zimbra).Everyone for their own.
Zimbra you pay for the features you need.
Kopano you pay for the official releases.I prefer Kopano you Zimbra that's great.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
If it is still missing then perhaps you should have asked them why and when it will be fixed.
I did, remember
They claimed it was never an issue. -
sure, sadly neither me nor you are in charge of them
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
sure, sadly neither me nor you are in charge of them
I was, for a decade.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I run whatever makes sense in my environments. If I can I run Centos if I can't I run Ubuntu but only LTS because I can not be bothered to upgarde every 6 months (this has nothing to do with Kopano, I am talking about other software).
In this case then, you can never call Canonical and expect to get full support - I guess this is OK with you?
Of course now that I say that, I'm willing to bet that to 99% it would be OK - why would it be OK? Because it's a free software and there is so little actual expected support for it that management either a) doesn't actually expect there to be OS support for it, or b) management does expect support and PAYS for it, at which point Canonical will inform them that only the latest and greatest gets full support and management will have to decide.
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@Dashrender said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I run whatever makes sense in my environments. If I can I run Centos if I can't I run Ubuntu but only LTS because I can not be bothered to upgarde every 6 months (this has nothing to do with Kopano, I am talking about other software).
In this case then, you can never call Canonical and expect to get full support - I guess this is OK with you?
I should be clear, it was at a hedge fund when I got to witness this. They called Canonical for support on a massive problem with their Ubuntu LTS and Canonical told them straight up that LTS doesn't get that kind of support. They provide the patches that provide, they will help walk you through things if you don't know how to use it, but for issues with the OS, you only get support if you move off of LTS and stay current. All OS fixes were for the latest release only.
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@MattSpeller said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I'd love to know how this has boiled down, can someone TL;DR this 200 post saga for me?
Scott bailed on Kopano, found the forum to be wanting. and the product to not work on Vendor supported Enterprise OSes.
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@scottalanmiller said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
@MattSpeller said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I'd love to know how this has boiled down, can someone TL;DR this 200 post saga for me?
Yes, and I'll do another thread of our findings. But it comes down to: Zimbra surprised us as the clear winner. Kopano just wasn't up to the job. But has nice features that we'd like to have, but don't need.
Thank you, looking forward to that.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I entirely disagree. Plenty of vendors still produced software for Windows XP although it was dead years ago.
Of course they do. And not one would I consider production ready. That, by definition, to me is hobby class software - a total joke and I can't take seriously any business that would go through route. What does that say about the business' opinion of itself?
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@Dashrender said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
@MattSpeller said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I'd love to know how this has boiled down, can someone TL;DR this 200 post saga for me?
Scott bailed on Kopano, found the forum to be wanting. and the product to not work on Vendor supported Enterprise OSes.
I wasn't the only one working on it, @romo was the first to voice concerns that it wasn't up to snuff.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
I entirely disagree. Plenty of vendors still produced software for Windows XP although it was dead years ago.
The software you produce is for your customers, not for the beauty of it.
In Brasil cars run on ethanol, so you have to make engines for that.
Same.
If you bought and deployed software today that only worked on XP, then I expect your company to fail in the near future. This would just be crazy.
This is basically what Scott is saying - I'm not saying I fully agree, but I see where he's coming from.
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@mcostan said in Finding the Best Open Source Email Solutions:
If you are a bank you want the minimum change possible to keep going. That's how they function. I work in that environment and trust me Ubuntu 16.10 will be here in 2028
And we wonder why there are so many problems with banks? wonder why they are so out dated, often don't have modern choices.
