RingCentral and Vonage
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@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
How did we get ruled out, but not RingCentral?
I was asked to review the Ringcentral quote and give my opinion. It seems it has been very much decided to trial RingCentral before it got to me (without me realizing). I did suggest some providers to look at but it doesn't seem like those will be entertained so I gave my 2 cents and left it at that for now.
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
UC is a scam,...
Yeah I know. Higher up are drinking the cool aid with the whole 'presence' thing. Office365 integrated calling (via Telstra) were looked at and discarded due to cost and wasn't going to work for our use case.
Let not even go into the 'magic quadrant' crap! (hint it was brought up).
Feel free to continue the discussions. However my original purpose is concluded. Aka I wouldn't have bothered had I known what I know now of the 'requirements'. Dam its frustrating at times trying to do your best and get hampered by arbitrary things.
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@JaredBusch said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Ring central requires you to buy or lease the phones. They are not included in the advertised price. Since you have Yealinks, you should be fine.
Yes I know. I have put in my 2 cents about recommending we keep using Yealinks from a performance & price angle. We currently use the T46S as our standard.
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@Dashrender said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Also looking at the next level that involve muti-country and all that "UC" stuff (to some degree, more like using a VOIP App).
UC is a scam, like UTMs. Sounds fancy, but really has no business purpose. Avoid UC. Don't avoid UC platforms, every phone platform is called UC now. But don't use any UC features, it's just stupid. Phones are phones, trying to make them into everything else is going to be a terrible experience for the business and cost a lot of money while making things that have long ago been solved into problems again.
I've kinda wondered that briefly from time to time.... I can't really imagine what a person wants to unify with their phone system - short of getting voicemails sent to email, and possibly counting fax to email as part of UC as well. Personally I don't see video chat in the phone arena, it's it's own thing - though obviously doesn't need to be.
Isn't UC just a package deal, locking you in to one vendor with several products?
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@JaredBusch said in RingCentral and Vonage:
In the 1000 user range I would expect RC to be $10/user or less.
We are not putting everything in initially. So would only be a small deployment. pricing seems ok-ish on the quote.
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
I wonder if that remains true in Australia where the underlying telephony costs are so much higher.
If you have a high enough volume than pricing is reasonable enough. Telstra here charges approx $35 - $40 a month for a 'landline / PSTN' so that's what everyone trying to price to.
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Dam its frustrating at times trying to do your best and get hampered by arbitrary things.
Yeah that happens to all of us at time for sure.
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@JaredBusch said in RingCentral and Vonage:
In the 1000 user range I would expect RC to be $10/user or less.
We are not putting everything in initially. So would only be a small deployment. pricing seems ok-ish on the quote.
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
I wonder if that remains true in Australia where the underlying telephony costs are so much higher.
If you have a high enough volume than pricing is reasonable enough. Telstra here charges approx $35 - $40 a month for a 'landline / PSTN' so that's what everyone trying to price to.
You can't compare the costs of PSTN to that of users, etc on a PBX, at least not that I can see. Unless you're telling me that everyone has their own landline now, and you're getting hit for $35-40 for each user already...
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@JaredBusch said in RingCentral and Vonage:
In the 1000 user range I would expect RC to be $10/user or less.
We are not putting everything in initially. So would only be a small deployment. pricing seems ok-ish on the quote.
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
I wonder if that remains true in Australia where the underlying telephony costs are so much higher.
If you have a high enough volume than pricing is reasonable enough. Telstra here charges approx $35 - $40 a month for a 'landline / PSTN' so that's what everyone trying to price to.
That seems really excessive to me.
I don't know Twilio very well as a company, but their pricing seems way better. $2.50 per DID and .02 per minute. You'd have to get a current phone bill and do a little math, but Twilio's sort of pricing would work out better many times. Even if you are paying someone else to admin the system.
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@Dashrender said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Also looking at the next level that involve muti-country and all that "UC" stuff (to some degree, more like using a VOIP App).
UC is a scam, like UTMs. Sounds fancy, but really has no business purpose. Avoid UC. Don't avoid UC platforms, every phone platform is called UC now. But don't use any UC features, it's just stupid. Phones are phones, trying to make them into everything else is going to be a terrible experience for the business and cost a lot of money while making things that have long ago been solved into problems again.
I've kinda wondered that briefly from time to time.... I can't really imagine what a person wants to unify with their phone system - short of getting voicemails sent to email, and possibly counting fax to email as part of UC as well. Personally I don't see video chat in the phone arena, it's it's own thing - though obviously doesn't need to be.
It's not, video is just a native part of all voice systems. No one uses it, but every system has had it for decades. Now they present it like it's special and call it "UC" and try to convince people that everyone else hasn't always had it.
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Yeah I know. Higher up are drinking the cool aid with the whole 'presence' thing.
Phone systems have presence. UC isn't presence. Just call everything UC and the problem is solved. Everything has texting, presence, video, vmail, vmail to email, etc. Literally everyone.
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@jmoore said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@Dashrender said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Also looking at the next level that involve muti-country and all that "UC" stuff (to some degree, more like using a VOIP App).
UC is a scam, like UTMs. Sounds fancy, but really has no business purpose. Avoid UC. Don't avoid UC platforms, every phone platform is called UC now. But don't use any UC features, it's just stupid. Phones are phones, trying to make them into everything else is going to be a terrible experience for the business and cost a lot of money while making things that have long ago been solved into problems again.
I've kinda wondered that briefly from time to time.... I can't really imagine what a person wants to unify with their phone system - short of getting voicemails sent to email, and possibly counting fax to email as part of UC as well. Personally I don't see video chat in the phone arena, it's it's own thing - though obviously doesn't need to be.
Isn't UC just a package deal, locking you in to one vendor with several products?
Not really. It's a buzzword that literally means nothing.
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
If you have a high enough volume than pricing is reasonable enough. Telstra here charges approx $35 - $40 a month for a 'landline / PSTN' so that's what everyone trying to price to.
Only people trying to sabotage their own businesses. I guarantee you can do it for a tiny fraction of that, but someone high up in your org is playing "politics" and keeping pricing from being discussed.
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@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Only people trying to sabotage their own businesses. I guarantee you can do it for a tiny fraction of that
I'm never paying Telstra price. It was just a reference for discussion. Most telco here will give you a all you can eat for much less. Their obvious selling point is 'we beat Telstra'. To most average SMB its a saving to them.
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Well, I live in Australia and know quite a bit about local VoIP providers. As far as I'm concerned, no one does it better here than Maxotel. I am not a reseller and don't get any kickbacks from any vendors but their Asterisk-based hosted PBX and their support team have been absolutely amazing in my experience. Check them out.
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@taurex said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Well, I live in Australia and know quite a bit about local VoIP providers. As far as I'm concerned, no one does it better here than Maxotel. I am not a reseller and don't get any kickbacks from any vendors but their Asterisk-based hosted PBX and their support team have been absolutely amazing in my experience. Check them out.
Their PBX base price is great, but their per minute cost to dial is very high and they line limit. So if you have any number or users or make any amount of calls, their pricing is pretty high for the market.
I don't know about normal handsets, but their handset prices are significantly higher than any market we've seen and we work all over the world.
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@taurex said in RingCentral and Vonage:
no one does it better here than Maxotel
This I agree. I spoke to them previously a while ago and they did impress me at the time. On another form I frequent they consistently get good feedback.
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
their handset prices are significantly higher than any market we've seen and we work all over the world.
Welcome to Australian pricing / tax.
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@360col if you know other Aussies looking for phones there, it looks like we beat Maxotel on price
We'd appreciate the reference. -
@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Welcome to Australian pricing / tax.
I bet we can find them there for way, way less.
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@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
I bet we can find them there for way, way less.
I just had a look at Maxotel's price. We definitely get if for way less. My previous point Australian general have to pay much more due to location / size of market.
Price search engine I frequently use for Aus https://www.staticice.com.au/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=yealink+T46S
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@360col said in RingCentral and Vonage:
@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
I bet we can find them there for way, way less.
I just had a look at Maxotel's price. We definitely get if for way less. My previous point Australian general have to pay much more due to location / size of market.
Price search engine I frequently use for Aus https://www.staticice.com.au/cgi-bin/search.cgi?q=yealink+T46S
That looks better.
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@scottalanmiller said in RingCentral and Vonage:
Their PBX base price is great, but their per minute cost to dial is very high and they line limit. So if you have any number or users or make any amount of calls, their pricing is pretty high for the market.
I don't know about normal handsets, but their handset prices are significantly higher than any market we've seen and we work all over the world.
Call to mobiles are always expensive in Australia, the rest of the outgoing calls are only charged per call, not per minute. As for the handsets, yes, Maxo sells them with a quite a bit of a margin but they don't customise any handset firmware like some other telcos here that lock you in with their handsets. We buy them from other retailers for a lot less. What's great about their PBX is practically everything can be done via their web admin interface. Other telcos here are miles behind in terms in terms of convenience and functionality of a web GUI.
