Calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox Experts
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@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@FATeknollogee said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@JaredBusch said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
I tested it once years and years ago. hated it and never touched it again.
JB, it might be time to test again.
It looks like it has some promise...
I'm only in the very early stages of testing, but I do like that I can have the hypervisor o/s installed on ZFS Raid1 & build a hyperconverged Ceph cluster for VM storage.Why do you want either ZFS or CEPH for that use case?
No HW RAID cards?
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@FATeknollogee said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@FATeknollogee said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@JaredBusch said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
I tested it once years and years ago. hated it and never touched it again.
JB, it might be time to test again.
It looks like it has some promise...
I'm only in the very early stages of testing, but I do like that I can have the hypervisor o/s installed on ZFS Raid1 & build a hyperconverged Ceph cluster for VM storage.Why do you want either ZFS or CEPH for that use case?
No HW RAID cards?
I hope you've more than that to offer. KVM and Xen do hardware RAID free options already but without the problems of ZFS or CEPH. What else do you have?
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@travisdh1 was just posting yesterday about how he'd never use ZFS or BtrFS for virtualization since they are so slow.
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Proxmox has a history of randomly breaking things, which is why I switched to XenServer when that was open sourced.
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@travisdh1 said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
Proxmox has a history of randomly breaking things, which is why I switched to XenServer when that was open sourced.
And a history of trolling to promote the product with fake accounts. It's a weird product with a bad online track record. It's KVM with weird stuff piles on top. Give me straight KVM any day.
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Native KVM will to ZFS, XFS, BtrFS, CEPH, DRBD or Starwind as well. None of that stuff comes from ProxMox.
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@travisdh1 said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
You could install Debian 8.3, and then do a manual install of Proxmox on top of that. I honestly don't want to touch Proxmox again.
Can you really layer ProxMox on top of something else? Never looked at it as an add on service before.
What distro does ProxMox build on natively.
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@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@travisdh1 was just posting yesterday about how he'd never use ZFS or BtrFS for virtualization since they are so slow.
No ZFS for virtualization!
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@FATeknollogee said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@travisdh1 was just posting yesterday about how he'd never use ZFS or BtrFS for virtualization since they are so slow.
No ZFS for virtualization!
Right. No ZFS for virtualization. Although I argued that its speed problems aren't as bad as it seems. Still, XFS for me unless a specific need arises.
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@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@travisdh1 said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
You could install Debian 8.3, and then do a manual install of Proxmox on top of that. I honestly don't want to touch Proxmox again.
Can you really layer ProxMox on top of something else? Never looked at it as an add on service before.
What distro does ProxMox build on natively.
AFAIK, it's built on Debian
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ZFS and BtrFS really are adequately fast in most use cases. Nearly all. You lose some speed but if chosen for other reasons they are good options.
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@FATeknollogee said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@travisdh1 said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
You could install Debian 8.3, and then do a manual install of Proxmox on top of that. I honestly don't want to touch Proxmox again.
Can you really layer ProxMox on top of something else? Never looked at it as an add on service before.
What distro does ProxMox build on natively.
AFAIK, it's built on Debian
Looks that way.
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Yeah, when we were running Proxmox here, I had to use the manual install method because they don't include drivers for a lot of network cards out of the box.
Install Debian -> Install Network Drivers (if needed) -> install Proxmox via repositories
Just one of many broken things about it (the network cards were on the HCL at the time).
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From Mellanox it looks like the issue is just that Debian and ProxMox are not well supported. No surprise as those aren't really enterprise platforms. Debian is great but you get Ubuntu if you want enterprise Debian. And PM.... well, Id put it was a hobby system.
If you use RHEL, CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu or Suse it looks like you can be fully updated and supported with Mellanox.
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@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
From Mellanox it looks like the issue is just that Debian and ProxMox are not well supported. No surprise as those aren't really enterprise platforms. Debian is great but you get Ubuntu if you want enterprise Debian. And PM.... well, Id put it was a hobby system.
If you use RHEL, CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu or Suse it looks like you can be fully updated and supported with Mellanox.
Proxmox isn't even a hobby system, to me it's a never use.
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You might want to ping Mellanox support to see if they have something more recent for Debian that just isn't in the rralase notes yet. But my advice is to steer clear of ProxMox. This is the kind of problem I'd expect you to run into often.
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@travisdh1 said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
@scottalanmiller said in calling Debian Stretch & Mellanox experts!!:
From Mellanox it looks like the issue is just that Debian and ProxMox are not well supported. No surprise as those aren't really enterprise platforms. Debian is great but you get Ubuntu if you want enterprise Debian. And PM.... well, Id put it was a hobby system.
If you use RHEL, CentOS, Fedora, Ubuntu or Suse it looks like you can be fully updated and supported with Mellanox.
Proxmox isn't even a hobby system, to me it's a never use.
Well I never deploy hobby systems
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If you want a scale out, no hardware RAID, hyperconverged KVM option, you might want to think about something like Fedora with KVM, use MD RAID, XFS, then add in the new Starwind Linux VSA for KVM.
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Problem solved.
Had to change both ports on the ConnectX-3 from the default of "IB" to "Eth". -
The only advantage to ProxMox I see is the specific owners for VMs(can do it through polkit but it's annoying). Also a small portion the fact that there is a usable web interface but it's been years since I've used it. I use cli and Virtual-Manager, but it is annoying if you try to manage from a Windows machine.
If all they did was create a web interface it would be much better.
I'll never understand the point of ZFS for a hypervisor. Better snapshotting is available through libvirt and that's the only thing I see people say they use it for.
