@fuznutz04 said in MangoCon 2019:
@JaredBusch said in MangoCon 2019:
@fuznutz04 said in MangoCon 2019:
Is anyone at the Holiday Inn Las Colinas? I'm hungry and was going to walk to the Draft house...
me.
I was impatient and took the shuttle to the draft house to cram a burger in my face.
Plan for a few extra minutes for traffic. There is a slayer concert next door.
Looked busy out there...
@scottalanmiller said in What Are You Doing Right Now:
Looks like all flights into Dallas have at least a little delay from the storm.
Yea, 90 extra minutes of airport drinking in Minneapolis! I can watch some CanPL or EPL replays
Making dessert, playing brawl stars, and thinking about upgrading my ancient snipeit installation (4.1)
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@donaldlandru said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
Ok. So every PC shoots back a message that says I did what you told me too, or here is my current status. Now my main PC needs a Windows server license?
In this kinda weird example, no. The original PC could stay on Windows 10 because it is "asking" for status. Unless they are doing something weird to respond, that's fine.
But what would be problematic is that each of the OTHER PCs that it is talking to, the ones that are listening, would all need Windows Server licenses! So it is not what you think, but is actually far worse than you were picturing!
I think you have answered it perfectly! In Microsoft's ideal world almost every PC would need Windows Server.
I have iTunes installed and the iTunes remote app on my phone. I stream music from my iTunes Server and there is status commands back and forth.
I installed Plex Media Server on my main PC, there is a Windows Server (maybe could exclude this under file sharing, not sure)
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@donaldlandru said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
I have a java program that runs on my main PC, and shoots messages to my other PCs that are listening on a port.
At this point, I must throw away Windows Desktop and upgrade all of my machines to Windows Server?No, that's not a server, that's a client. But I know where you are trying to go. So to answer EXACTLY what you asked, no, you are okay with the PC that we are looking at.
Ok. So every PC shoots back a message that says I did what you told me too, or here is my current status. Now my main PC needs a Windows server license?
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
What would the difference be if it does provide the service to other PC's on the network ?
or doesnt?Local server vs. network server. Local servers are everywhere. Download Atom (the text file editor.) It's great. It also runs a full web and application server locally to do what it does. Even has a full network stack. It's a marvel of software engineering. Also a nice product.
But it doesn't talk over the network. It's all local. You can freely use it on Windows 7. No problem.
But using something like osTicket over a network turns your Windows 7 machine into a network server, and then requires Windows Server licensing.
Will osTicket run under IIS or does it have its own web server?
So consider this scenario.. because it sounds to be the basis of your point.
I have a java program that runs on my main PC, and shoots messages to my other PCs that are listening on a port.
At this point, I must throw away Windows Desktop and upgrade all of my machines to Windows Server?
@scottalanmiller said in What did you have for lunch or dinner today?:
@donaldlandru said in What did you have for lunch or dinner today?:
35 miles from me to the nearest burrito.
What? Time to move.
This is Minnesota, not Texas, after all. I mean I have a Taco Bell 20 miles away, but I wouldn't consider that viable.
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@donaldlandru said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
Section iii Device connections
In the case of a database application I would call this "synchronizing data" in which case there is no limitation.In no way whatsoever is this what that is, however. You can't just call database data synchronization. It's not at all. Not even kinda.
I would say that depends on implementation.
In the Oracle case, the transaction is wrote to the local database and then sent up to the lead database later.. Not sure how you wouldn't call that synchronization.
So tricky Microsoft at best.. Using this as my source:
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English.htm
Restrictions. The device manufacturer or installer and Microsoft reserve all rights (such as rights under intellectual property laws) not expressly granted in this agreement. For example, this license does not give you any right to, and you may not:
(i) use or virtualize features of the software separately;
(ii) publish, copy (other than the permitted backup copy), rent, lease, or lend the software;
(iii) transfer the software (except as permitted by this agreement);
(iv) work around any technical restrictions or limitations in the software;
(v) use the software as server software, for commercial hosting, make the software available for simultaneous use by multiple users over a network, install the software on a server and allow users to access it remotely, or install the software on a device for use only by remote users;
(vi) reverse engineer, decompile, or disassemble the software, or attempt to do so, except and only to the extent that the foregoing restriction is (a) permitted by applicable law; (b) permitted by licensing terms governing the use of open-source components that may be included with the software; or (c) required to debug changes to any libraries licensed under the GNU Lesser General Public License which are included with and linked to by the software; and
(vii) when using Internet-based features you may not use those features in any way that could interfere with anyone else’s use of them, or to try to gain access to or use any service, data, account, or network, in an unauthorized manner.
Section v
So, I interpret this as using the OS over the network (i.e. Remote desktop connetions)
Multi use scenarios.
(i) Multiple versions. If when acquiring the software you were provided with multiple versions (such as 32-bit and 64-bit versions), you may install and activate only one of those versions at a time.
(ii) Multiple or pooled connections. Hardware or software you use to multiplex or pool connections, or reduce the number of devices or users that access or use the software, does not reduce the number of licenses you need. You may only use such hardware or software if you have a license for each instance of the software you are using.
(iii) Device connections. You may allow up to 20 other devices to access the software installed on the licensed device for the purpose of using the following software features: file services, print services, Internet information services, and Internet connection sharing and telephony services on the licensed device. You may allow any number of devices to access the software on the licensed device to synchronize data between devices. This section does not mean, however, that you have the right to install the software, or use the primary function of the software (other than the features listed in this section), on any of these other devices.
(iv) Use in a virtualized environment. This license allows you to install only one instance of the software for use on one device, whether that device is physical or virtual. If you want to use the software on more than one virtual device, you must obtain a separate license for each instance.
(v) Remote access. No more than once every 90 days, you may designate a single user who physically uses the licensed device as the licensed user. The licensed user may access the licensed device from another device using remote access technologies. Other users, at different times, may access the licensed device from another device using remote access technologies, but only on devices separately licensed to run the same or higher edition of this software.
(vi) Remote assistance. You may use remote assistance technologies to share an active session without obtaining any additional licenses for the software. Remote assistance allows one user to connect directly to another user’s computer, usually to correct problems.
Section iii Device connections
In the case of a database application I would call this "synchronizing data" in which case there is no limitation.
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@donaldlandru said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
With that said, Oracle Xstore is not even supported on Windows Server.
What this means is that the product simply isn't supported anywhere in the first world. It has no supported stack. For something to be "supported" in IT terms requires support end to end. With Xstore, this means that they don't have any support stack.
Lots of really crappy hobby class vendors (Oracle is this for sure) do this as a trick to guarantee zero legal accountability for support. If you run a desktop OS, they can claim that that isn't a server product and they can't support you (and they can threaten to turn you over to MS if they want - they have bilateral agreements for this through the BSA.) And if you don't run on a desktop OS, they can claim you don't fall under their support. This guarantees them an "out" to not support you no matter what you do. There is no possible end to end support path, none. It's impossible.
In IT terms, it simply means that it is an unsupported product. Across the board. It simply exists without support. Caveat emptor. Anyone buying it simply can't tell their companies that they got a supported product. They paid for commercial, closed source software without a support agreement. Oracle may or may not provide support, but is never required to. It's purely at their discretion.
Scott I just found this article.
https://logicalread.com/sql-server-express-as-a-production-database/#.XKZF-VVKjRY
Does this hold an real validation?
So I saw nothing amiss in the article. But I also found nothing related to this discussion in it, either. The article is about MS SQL Server, which was never in question. It is Windows 7 that is being used instead of paying for the Windows Server license which is required. That MS SQL Server is involved is neither here nor there.
I think he is referring to the last section which doesn't relate to licensing just where the software will run
SQL Server Express is a great choice for small-scale, cost-effective multi-user database implementations. It can run on both Windows
desktop operating systems like Windows 7, 8, 8.1, and 10, as well as server operating systems like Windows Server 2008, 2008 R2, 2012, and 2012 R2. It is completely compatible with the Standard, Business Intelligence, and Enterprise editions of SQL Server 2014, and can be upgraded to any of these editions. Microsoft
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@jmoore said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs If it is running and using server software then that machine is acting as a server. I think that is what is meant. Hope that makes sense.
Yeah, it's a duck situation. If you don't want to get into legalise of the EULA...
If it looks like a duck and acts like a duck, it's a duck.
If it looks like a server and acts like a server, it's a server.
In this case, it couldn't look more like a server. It's clearly "the server", it is provides multiple services to other machines and people, and both the actions it performs (database server) and the product it runs (MS SQL Server) have "server" in the names. No grey area, it's as server as a server can be.
Yea the sticky situation of, by all definitions this is wrong; however, there is not much I can change. All likelihood even selecting a different point of service product needs the same topology and may even prevent you from using it in the "legal" manner.
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
If SQL Server is there for no function whatsoever, then it might not qualify as a server. But if that is the case, turn it off as that is certainly using a lot of resources that can't be afforded on such an ancient machine.
The way new aloha manager works, from what I'm told- It breaks the changes down into the sql. Then it imports into the file folders and sends the change to the front of house.
SQL is needed for information to pass along to the front of house.Yup. A bit weird, but doesn't change that SQL Server is being used and is needed. That there is another connection process in between is just part of the API and neither here nor there in a licensing discussion.
Scott,
Clarify, are you saying his "register" systems need to be running Windows Server or that he needs to be running the paid version of SQL Server instead of SQL Express?
I'll go out on a limb and infer the if Oracle was directing people to pirate Microsoft licensing, Microsoft would be saying something about it.
With that said, Oracle Xstore is not even supported on Windows Server.
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
How is It not licensed ?
Because there is no license. Windows 7 can never be used like this. It's unlicensable as a server. It's that simple. This is just pirated.
What makes this a "server" in this case? Either I missed something or something else is being read into this.
It is pretty common in the point of service space for one register to play the role of "lead" and all other registers are slaves.
@scottalanmiller said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@donaldlandru said in Windows 7 Pro 32 bit - Low on Memory... Ideas?:
@WrCombs ahh OK.. The company I work for specializes in the old Oracle Retail (ORPOS) and Oracle Xstore (previously Micros Xstore, previously Store21, previously Datavantage) and those are all on Java. They also all have MSSQL on every register, so.. thought I would throw my thoughts in.
LOL, Oracle requires MS SQL Server. JAJAJA
Yes that is a running joke around my parts. Oracle has been "fixing" that limitation since they bought the Xstore product.
@scottalanmiller said in What did you have for lunch or dinner today?:
@donaldlandru on national burrito day? Fail.
I wasn't aware of these things or I would have had my Chipotle copy-cat bowl today instead of yesterday. 35 miles from me to the nearest burrito.
Not a pretty picture, sausage link and cauliflower “mac” and cheese.
@WrCombs ahh OK.. The company I work for specializes in the old Oracle Retail (ORPOS) and Oracle Xstore (previously Micros Xstore, previously Store21, previously Datavantage) and those are all on Java. They also all have MSSQL on every register, so.. thought I would throw my thoughts in.