Size of MSPs
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@Minion-Queen said:
@Aaron-Studer said:
How full time staff members does NTG have?
We have a total of 8 full timers and about 40 or so part-time/contractors that work with us when project needs arise.
Out of curiosity how many clients do you have? Or a ratio of IT (your full timers) to clients?
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Wow that is a little hard to answer. We have about 100 clients that need us often. and about 200 that use or have used us for project work. We also have a few Vendors that are clients as well.
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@Minion-Queen Are your part-time contractors generally there for on-site support when your usual people aren't local?
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Yes. We also partner with a few other small MSP's that help us out from time to time if needed.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
@scottalanmiller said:
NTG really isn't an MSP, we are an IT Outsourcer,
I have no idea what the difference in. From Wikipedia : "Managed services are the practice of outsourcing day-to-day management responsibilities and functions as a strategic method for improving operations and cutting expenses." That sounds like IT outsourcing to me.
In practical terms, MSPs are the companies that do "managed services" which are predefined and typically billed on a per unit basis. It's that it is "managed services".
As an IT Outsourcer we act exactly like an internal IT department, not like a managed services vendor. MSPs are like many outsources like ADP for example. You adjust to them, not them to you. They have a specific service that they offer, and it is good, but you need to make your workflow work with them.
IT Outsourcers outsource IT only, not only IT in the form of a "managed service." It is a far more flexible service type.
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Serious lack of data
That's like saying accountants don't exist because they are not a member of club X.
I've never heard of NTG in the UK pre-Spiceworks.
http://www.phoenix.co.uk/accreditations/
https://www.softcat.com/what-we-do/managed-services
http://www.qubicgroup.com/pages/qubic/about-us.phpHow are you defining the concept of MSP?
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@Breffni-Potter said:
Serious lack of data
That's like saying accountants don't exist because they are not a member of club X.
I've never heard of NTG in the UK pre-Spiceworks.
What is this a reference to? What's like saying that?
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@Breffni-Potter said:
How are you defining the concept of MSP?
A provider of managed services (in IT.) I think the real question is how "managed services" are defined. NTG provides IT services, not managed services. If you work with traditional MSPs, it is really clear the difference. They have packaged managed services that they predefine, often tied to their VAR side but not necessarily.
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@Breffni-Potter said:
I've never heard of NTG in the UK pre-Spiceworks.
NTG didn't enter the UK until after being active on Spiceworks. No idea what this is implying.
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@scottalanmiller said:
NTG didn't enter the UK until after being active on Spiceworks. No idea what this is implying.
In relation to what you originally said which was:
@scottalanmiller said:
From what I have seen in dealing with communities like Spiceworks, MSPs are extremely small. It appears that the average MSP is a part time affair, typically one IT guy supplementing his day job. A few are multiple part timers like this.
What seems to be rare is the staffed MSPs that have dedicated IT and business functions that have enough people to qualify as a team and be able to have schedules, shifts, vacation, training and other internal resources. The ability to consult each other and bounce ideas, double check things, hand things off, etc.It's like, your set of data is Spiceworks, so you are making a decision that everyone is tiny
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@Breffni-Potter said:
http://www.phoenix.co.uk/accreditations/
https://www.softcat.com/what-we-do/managed-services
http://www.qubicgroup.com/pages/qubic/about-us.phpWhat were this links supposed to be for? Those look like MSPs. Notice that SoftCat, for example, has to develop each "managed service". They aren't providing straight IT, they have to make a service package before providing it. That's the MSP model that I'm talking about. Phoenix, for example, has a heavy focus on their partners which generally implies a similar model.
So yes, this is data supporting how I was explaining MSPs, if that was your intent.
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....But how can you call Softcat "Tiny"
Their annual boat party budget at 1 mil probably blows most SMBs out of the water.
Just seems crazy to call most MSPs tiny when there are a huge number of bigger players out there.
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@Breffni-Potter said:
It's like, your set of data is Spiceworks, so you are making a decision that everyone is tiny
As SW is the largest global pool of the market, it's a decent reference point. Few other resources have thousands of MSPs in one place to compare them. I know of no one else offering a self registration global MSP directory, for example, either.
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@Breffni-Potter said:
....But how can you call Softcat "Tiny"
Their annual boat party budget at 1 mil probably blows most SMBs out of the water.
Who called them tiny? Certainly not me.
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@Minion-Queen said:
@Aaron-Studer said:
How full time staff members does NTG have?
We have a total of 8 full timers and about 40 or so part-time/contractors that work with us when project needs arise.
For comparison, Bundy & Associates is 4 full time employees, 2 part time employees, and a number of contract employees available for project work.
Our client base is also a lot smaller. than NTG's.
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@scottalanmiller said:
As SW is the largest global pool of the market, it's a decent reference point. Few other resources have thousands of MSPs in one place to compare them.
But no one past a certain size seems to care about being represented there. So your data is skewed about representation of MSPs to begin with?
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HTS has 1 emp. he wants to be a MSP, but alas, i'm an IT guy who works for himself.
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But surely the directory is broken even more, if a one man consultant with a website is an "IT Service Provider" on the community, then that skews the data even more.
Maybe the issue is no one knows how to classify providers anymore? Bit like "Cloud" services.
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@Breffni-Potter said:
@scottalanmiller said:
As SW is the largest global pool of the market, it's a decent reference point. Few other resources have thousands of MSPs in one place to compare them.
But no one past a certain size seems to care about being represented there. So your data is skewed about representation of MSPs to begin with?
That's true to some degree. Although some large shops are there or have been there. But you assume that there are an abundance of large shops and few small ones and only small ones take the time to have a social media presence or build an online reputation. What makes that true? You are assuming that there is a high percentage of large shops and that they just aren't visible with online presences. What makes that true?
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I guess it's because I worked for a shop which had 6 staff, plus contractors, X number of clients. We heard and dealt with many other shops of a similar size, none of whom had a presence on Spiceworks. In fact there are even smaller outfits with 1-2 people who have not heard of it.
