question about setting up a new domain controller
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@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dashrender said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
then I'd say you got some kinda of awesome rare deal.
Not really, just find some dude who sells AppRiver O365 E1/E3 (or whatever you need) licenses cheaper than the AppRiver website lists them for, that are also cheaper than MS sells them for directly.
That's not direct, though. MS no longer has control of your data, AppRiver owns you. MS isn't allowed to vary the prices for their system. There is no volume discount for partners.
That made me think of something.. having Exchange in house would mean that we own our email, not MS. I've been thinking about this thread all day and I'm still thinking that Exchange 2016 on site would be fine for us vs O365 Exchange. I mean, we've had Exchange 2010 running for years and years now and have had zero issues with it. Our Exchange server has only about 800GB of storage and it's nowhere near full because the majority of historical emails have been offloaded to Mimecast, which is our 3rd party hosted spam filter/email archive vendor. If anything, they are the ones who own our email data. Having Exchange in house would mean things run faster internally and it wouldn't be dependent on our internet connection.
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Then you are still reliant on you works internet connection if you want email outside of your internal network.
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If you only need email onprem then I feel like there are better and cheaper options for realtime messaging than email or exchange server.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
Then you are still reliant on you works internet connection if you want email outside of your internal network.
The majority of the email use is during work hours though (internal emails being sent between departments). Being able to use email during business hours when the internet is down is better than not being able to use email during business hours when the internet is down.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If you only need email onprem then I feel like there are better and cheaper options for realtime messaging than email or exchange server.
Same here but everyone is already used to Outlook and MS products. What are ya gonna do?
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@dave247 said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If you only need email onprem then I feel like there are better and cheaper options for realtime messaging than email or exchange server.
Same here but everyone is already used to Outlook and MS products. What are ya gonna do?
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@dave247 said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If you only need email onprem then I feel like there are better and cheaper options for realtime messaging than email or exchange server.
Same here but everyone is already used to Outlook and MS products. What are ya gonna do?
Shoot them?
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
Yeah, but I don't really care who owns the movie ticket (license)... I'm still getting all MS products, services, and support.
At AppRiver's discretion. It's great that you are getting that, but the stated prices are double those of going direct, and the risk is they will cut you off as you don't own the account. AppRiver is a good company, but it is still a layer of risk.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dbeato said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dashrender said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dbeato said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
How in the world are we ending up into Office 365 pricing from a domain controller question ? I guess I can see the point, but mainly I believe @Tim_G received Appriver's re-seller pricing or internal to them pricing which he probably cannot say here.
Because Scott suggested that the OP change Exchange of the environment before making changes to the DCs, since it is the OPs plan to do something to Exchange anyway.
I see, I didn't miss that but I guess the discussion is about pricing now.
Yeah.
Some are saying that because I'm buying E1/E3 O365 licenses from AppRiver or similar reseller, that I'm somehow not getting real O365 and that I now have VAR issues.
I am failing to see any of those claims, as from my view, are completely false.
Nothing changed between paying MS for our licenses, to paying AppRiver for our licenses.
But they are TRUE. You don't have guaranteed anything, it's all at AppRiver's discretion. They decide to let MS interfaces be exposed to you (for now), they decide to let MS handle some support (without the concierge benefits of the partner relationship... for now), they decide to make it transparent (for now.) It's all "up to them" and not something you control. And, from their website, they don't even offer a matching service to O365 so it is very hard to tell if you are getting a good deal, or not.
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@dave247 said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dashrender said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
then I'd say you got some kinda of awesome rare deal.
Not really, just find some dude who sells AppRiver O365 E1/E3 (or whatever you need) licenses cheaper than the AppRiver website lists them for, that are also cheaper than MS sells them for directly.
That's not direct, though. MS no longer has control of your data, AppRiver owns you. MS isn't allowed to vary the prices for their system. There is no volume discount for partners.
That made me think of something.. having Exchange in house would mean that we own our email, not MS. I've been thinking about this thread all day and I'm still thinking that Exchange 2016 on site would be fine for us vs O365 Exchange. I mean, we've had Exchange 2010 running for years and years now and have had zero issues with it. Our Exchange server has only about 800GB of storage and it's nowhere near full because the majority of historical emails have been offloaded to Mimecast, which is our 3rd party hosted spam filter/email archive vendor. If anything, they are the ones who own our email data. Having Exchange in house would mean things run faster internally and it wouldn't be dependent on our internet connection.
Right, so all that Mimecast cost would go away. Think about how cheap Office 365 is once you don't have the cost of Mimecast any longer. It's pretty dramatic.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If you only need email onprem then I feel like there are better and cheaper options for realtime messaging than email or exchange server.
Even if you still want email, we like Zimbra better as an email server. That's the primary reason that we left O365, Zimbra was just... better.
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@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
but the stated prices are double those of going direct
No, nowhere close to double... AppRiver's stated prices for the E3 license is $21.95 and MS Direct is $20.00. How is AppRiver's price double?
But anywho... We aren't paying AppRiver's listed prices anyways... it's significantly lower, making it way cheaper (thousands per month cheaper) to pay AppRiver for our E1/E3 licensing instead of Microsoft directly, with no added risk that I have seen.
If AppRiver pulls the plug (they wont if they want our money), we start paying Microsoft then.... no loss.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
No, nowhere close to double... AppRiver's stated prices for the E3 license is $21.95 and MS Direct is $20.00. How is AppRiver's price double?
Email was like $8 instead of $4 if all you wanted was email. Double for what we are discussing, at least. I mean, $7.95 instead of $4, lol. But that's just about double.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If AppRiver pulls the plug (they wont if they want our money), we start paying Microsoft then.... no loss.
Except, you have zero guarantee that you CAN pay MS, since MS doesn't own your account. Could be a big loss. And AppRiver might be losing money on you in the hopes of getting other work, so they easily might want to cut you.
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@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dbeato said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dashrender said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@dbeato said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
How in the world are we ending up into Office 365 pricing from a domain controller question ? I guess I can see the point, but mainly I believe @Tim_G received Appriver's re-seller pricing or internal to them pricing which he probably cannot say here.
Because Scott suggested that the OP change Exchange of the environment before making changes to the DCs, since it is the OPs plan to do something to Exchange anyway.
I see, I didn't miss that but I guess the discussion is about pricing now.
Yeah.
Some are saying that because I'm buying E1/E3 O365 licenses from AppRiver or similar reseller, that I'm somehow not getting real O365 and that I now have VAR issues.
I am failing to see any of those claims, as from my view, are completely false.
Nothing changed between paying MS for our licenses, to paying AppRiver for our licenses.
But they are TRUE. You don't have guaranteed anything, it's all at AppRiver's discretion. They decide to let MS interfaces be exposed to you (for now), they decide to let MS handle some support (without the concierge benefits of the partner relationship... for now), they decide to make it transparent (for now.) It's all "up to them" and not something you control. And, from their website, they don't even offer a matching service to O365 so it is very hard to tell if you are getting a good deal, or not.
And if any of that were to ever change, we switch back to Microsoft without any repercussion.
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@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If AppRiver pulls the plug (they wont if they want our money), we start paying Microsoft then.... no loss.
Except, you have zero guarantee that you CAN pay MS, since MS doesn't own your account. Could be a big loss. And AppRiver might be losing money on you in the hopes of getting other work, so they easily might want to cut you.
We verified beforehand that we have a guarantee we can seamlessly switch back at any time.
You could lose 2 of the wrong drives in a RAID10 simultaneously too, but that doesn't stop people from using it. Could is a strong word.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If AppRiver pulls the plug (they wont if they want our money), we start paying Microsoft then.... no loss.
Except, you have zero guarantee that you CAN pay MS, since MS doesn't own your account. Could be a big loss. And AppRiver might be losing money on you in the hopes of getting other work, so they easily might want to cut you.
We verified beforehand that we have a guarantee we can seamlessly switch back at any time.
Did you get that in writing? If not... lol, you sucker, the sales peon took you for a ride.
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@travisdh1 said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@scottalanmiller said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
If AppRiver pulls the plug (they wont if they want our money), we start paying Microsoft then.... no loss.
Except, you have zero guarantee that you CAN pay MS, since MS doesn't own your account. Could be a big loss. And AppRiver might be losing money on you in the hopes of getting other work, so they easily might want to cut you.
We verified beforehand that we have a guarantee we can seamlessly switch back at any time.
Did you get that in writing? If not... lol, you sucker, the sales peon took you for a ride.
But we can switch back and forth seamlessly, it's so easy and it's done sometimes here and there for certain licenses for certain users in some locations and/or domains.
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To end this particular discussion...
If you are going to get O365, go for the best price you can get for the actual O365 product, whether it's MS direct, or through an AppRiver reseller.
If you need other services that AppRiver provides anyways, like spam/antivirus protection and/or email archiving... then it makes even more sense.
Make sure you know what you are buying.
If you don't need O365, Zimbra is a wonderful suggestion by Scott. If you don't need email, there are other alternatives for communication linked earlier.
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@tim_g said in question about setting up a new domain controller:
To end this particular discussion...
If you are going to get O365, go for the best price you can get for the actual O365 product, whether it's MS direct, or through an AppRiver reseller.
If you need other services that AppRiver provides anyways, like spam/antivirus protection and/or email archiving... then it makes even more sense.
Make sure you know what you are buying.
If you don't need O365, Zimbra is a wonderful suggestion by Scott. If you don't need email, there are other alternatives for communication linked earlier.
How is O365 with spam filtering? We have Mimecast (as I mentioned before) which provides spam filtering, malicious link and virus detection (active threat protection) among other things. Its been absolutely great at keeping crap from coming in through email -- which is like one of the number one places for threats.
