Backup System For 5 PC SMB
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@brianlittlejohn said:
I believe you will need a license for your test device as well.
And you can apply multiple Standard Licenses to machines, you get two vms for each license.
Hence why I think the 1:1 "test anytime" selling features of these packages, even at the server level, could be out of EULA.
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I'm going to go back in time and forget I ever saw this thread. Or better yet even started it. Muuuuuuuuuuuch easier.
LOL. (JUST KIDDING!!!!!!!!!!)
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@BRRABill said:
@brianlittlejohn said:
I believe you will need a license for your test device as well.
And you can apply multiple Standard Licenses to machines, you get two vms for each license.
Hence why I think the 1:1 "test anytime" selling features of these packages, even at the server level, could be out of EULA.
Not at all, it's completely covered. Tons of us use them, it's no issue at all. But like any other physical server platform, you have to license it. It's that simple. The Datto, as an example, is a server. You need the right licenses for it, nothing more.
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Imagine if you were buying an HP Proliant and it said "Runs Windows Server 2012 R2." You would not assume that running Windows on it was free, right? You'd assume that you need a license for the Windows on that box. That it can run Windows doesn't imply that you don't need licenses for the software that you want to run.
It is exactly the same for Unitrends, Datto or whomever. They are just another server and just need the same licenses as anything else. Don't think of them as special cases and it becomes pretty clear.
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I thought the VMs were tied to the physical server they were licensed for. I guess I am still unclear on that. Like you can move VMs between two DC licensed servers, but BOTH servers need the DC license.
I thought that if you bought a copy of 2012R2, you couldn't install a VM on that, and a VM on a separate machine. Both VMs had to stay with the original server.
Or I guess the better case here would be...I have two servers. One has 2012R2 on it. Now, I can move an instance of a VM to the second server, but that server has to also have a license with a free VM slot available.
Like you can't split the 2 VMs from 1 Standard license onto 2 servers. Both servers need a license. (Thus giving you 4 possible VMs, 2 on each server.)
So in theory you are saying something like a Unitrends box, you'd need to purchase a second license specifically for the Unitrends box, even though the box itself isn't running it 2012R2, but the virtual instance on it is.
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@BRRABill said:
I thought the VMs were tied to the physical server they were licensed for.
That would be super weird. No server system has ever been like that that I've ever been aware of. That's a desktop OS concept only. Or OEM, of course, which we don't even consider as a real thing.
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That is correct. For movement of the VM the Host has to have enough licenses for the maximum number of VMs it will run at once. That is what makes DC licensing attractive, one license unlimited VMs for that host.
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@BRRABill said:
Like you can move VMs between two DC licensed servers, but BOTH servers need the DC license.
DC licensing gives you "unlimited use of the hardware." Period, end of story. That's it. You can run any number of Windows VMs of the same version or lower on the single piece of hardware. There is no other limitations like you are imagining. You are making very simple licensing quite complex, that complexity does not exist. You can move any VM there or to another DC licensed machine anything you want.
We all do this constantly all of the time. VM mobility is part of every HA, FT, DR and LB plan out there.
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@BRRABill said:
I thought that if you bought a copy of 2012R2, you couldn't install a VM on that, and a VM on a separate machine. Both VMs had to stay with the original server.
Correct. You licenses two VMs on a single piece of hardware. Not a specific two, just two.
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@BRRABill said:
Or I guess the better case here would be...I have two servers. One has 2012R2 on it. Now, I can move an instance of a VM to the second server, but that server has to also have a license with a free VM slot available.
Correct.
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@BRRABill said:
Like you can't split the 2 VMs from 1 Standard license onto 2 servers. Both servers need a license. (Thus giving you 4 possible VMs, 2 on each server.)
Also correct.
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@BRRABill said:
So in theory you are saying something like a Unitrends box, you'd need to purchase a second license specifically for the Unitrends box, even though the box itself isn't running it 2012R2, but the virtual instance on it is.
Not sure what you mean by not running Windows Server 2012 R2, no physical server should run Windows. Windows should always be a VM on top of a hypervisor. So the Unitrends box, which runs KVM, is absolutely identical to any other potential server that might run your Windows VMs.
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@scottalanmiller said:
You can move any VM there or to another DC licensed machine anything you want.
That's the part in my single server, Standard edition I was missing. Me gets it now.
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Bottom line is, Windows licensing is expensive
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@scottalanmiller techsoup is one of the few perks of non-profit life
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I have found time and again that the incredible cost to managing and ensuring compliance for Microsoft licensing, rather than the actual cost of it, has been a driving factor for businesses choosing UNIX, mostly Linux. With most Linux options all of this complexity just melts away. You don't need to think about licenses at all, you just deploy what you need. With Windows you spend more time figuring out the licenses than it takes to manage Linux.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Not sure what you mean by not running Windows Server 2012 R2, no physical server should run Windows. Windows should always be a VM on top of a hypervisor. So the Unitrends box, which runs KVM, is absolutely identical to any other potential server that might run your Windows VMs.
What I mean is:
Let's say I have one Server 2012 R2 STandard and it is hosting a 2012 R2 VM. I am using some backup product to do image backups of this VM. Something on the backup product (whether it be a device or straight software) allows you to spin up a virtual instance of the backup image of that VM located on another machine. The backup box is running linux or whatever they use to do the backups, etc. But the virtual VM is running Server 2012, and thus needs a license.Or ... let's say I export the backup image from the backup box. I spin that up in VirtualBox to test it. I need ANOTHER license for Server 2012 to do that, correct?
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@BRRABill needs to post more questions. Still pretty new around here and already has two threads in the all time most popular list!
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Off-topic:
LOL every time I see you post, I think it's your icon posting. -
@BRRABill said:
Let's say I have one Server 2012 R2 STandard and it is hosting a 2012 R2 VM.
OSes can't host VMs. I think you are confusing Server with HyperV.
