Net Neutrality is Live
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@scottalanmiller said:
@thecreativeone91 said:
@Dashrender said:
Good point @scottalanmiller hadn't really thought about it that way before.
So in the future the content creators will just skip the distributors altogether and publish direct to the web via subscription or single pay to view choices.
There's always going to be a distributor of some sort unless it's just a Youtube show or something. You get so much more with a distributor as you bring the content where people are rather than making people come to each individual thing.
@thecreativeone91 said:
@Dashrender said:
Good point @scottalanmiller hadn't really thought about it that way before.
So in the future the content creators will just skip the distributors altogether and publish direct to the web via subscription or single pay to view choices.
There's always going to be a distributor of some sort unless it's just a Youtube show or something. You get so much more with a distributor as you bring the content where people are rather than making people come to each individual thing.
YouTube is a distributor just like Netflix, Hulu, Amazon VOD, etc.
Yeah, but they don't choose the content/quality so people have to sift through it much more so it's not quite the same.
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@thecreativeone91 said:
Yeah, but they don't choose the content/quality so people have to sift through it much more so it's not quite the same.
Sort of. But still, no need for a channel for that. Just because they "do", and that is arguable as it is, doesn't mean that a non-channel format can't do that too.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@IRJ said:
I am not exactly sure how Netflix pays for their shows, but It seems like they could just make their own channels with shows they already have. Although I believe that traditional channels are obsolete in this day and age.
What would be the purpose of a channel?
The reason for channel is to get you to watch something you wouldn't normally chose. There are decent shows on Netflix that may not appeal to you when you see the title and description, but if you actually watched 5-10 minutes of the show or movie then you might actually find something you like.
In reality it is really playlists that run all the time and you can peek whenever you like and maybe you will see something you like.
They could have channels for:
Reality TV
Outdoor and Nature TV
Comedy TV
Drama TV
and etc. -
@IRJ said:
The reason for channel is to get you to watch something you wouldn't normally chose.
I dont' understand, though. A channel only "forces" you to do this, it doesn't enable it. You can easily do that without a channel.
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@IRJ said:
In reality it is really playlists that run all the time and you can peek whenever you like and maybe you will see something you like.
Exactly, no need to move away from on demand to do this. You could even make a playlist that starts shows in the middle if the desire truly is to just make it such like old channels did.
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@thecreativeone91 said:
How would a netflix channel end re-runs? They only have so many episodes that are new.
main stream shows generally only make 15 or so episodes a year.
Where is that? Mainstream non speciality seem to be closer to 25, though lately it's probably closer to 20 per season.
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I thought that 22 was the US standard. UK is much lower.
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@scottalanmiller said:
I thought that 22 was the US standard. UK is much lower.
Yeah I thought I recalled hearing he was from the UK, and that would explain when he was going with 15.
I know channels like HBO and Showtime and AMC are making shorter season series, I think Breaking Bad was like 12-15 per season.
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@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@IRJ said:
I am not exactly sure how Netflix pays for their shows, but It seems like they could just make their own channels with shows they already have. Although I believe that traditional channels are obsolete in this day and age.
What would be the purpose of a channel?
The reason for channel is to get you to watch something you wouldn't normally chose. There are decent shows on Netflix that may not appeal to you when you see the title and description, but if you actually watched 5-10 minutes of the show or movie then you might actually find something you like.
In reality it is really playlists that run all the time and you can peek whenever you like and maybe you will see something you like.
They could have channels for:
Reality TV
Outdoor and Nature TV
Comedy TV
Drama TV
and etc.There is a valid point here, but as @scottalanmiller said you don't need a channel that can't be changed to do that. You can subscribe to a curated feed that would show you like minded things to your normal choices.
I hate the fact that I know there are things I want to watch but can't simply because the station isn't showing them when I want to watch them. Of course the DVR has solve a lot of that by allowing me to record things when I'm busy so I can watch them on my own schedule. But cord cutters and youngsters today don't want to hassle with that (and frankly neither do I). I would love to be able to bring up the Science Channel (man they are going to have to come up with a new name for that, maybe) and then I just the show they own I want to watch and go to town.
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@Dashrender said:
@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@IRJ said:
I am not exactly sure how Netflix pays for their shows, but It seems like they could just make their own channels with shows they already have. Although I believe that traditional channels are obsolete in this day and age.
What would be the purpose of a channel?
The reason for channel is to get you to watch something you wouldn't normally chose. There are decent shows on Netflix that may not appeal to you when you see the title and description, but if you actually watched 5-10 minutes of the show or movie then you might actually find something you like.
In reality it is really playlists that run all the time and you can peek whenever you like and maybe you will see something you like.
They could have channels for:
Reality TV
Outdoor and Nature TV
Comedy TV
Drama TV
and etc.There is a valid point here, but as @scottalanmiller said you don't need a channel that can't be changed to do that. You can subscribe to a curated feed that would show you like minded things to your normal choices.
I agree that you don't need it, but it would sure be convenient. My fiancee and I will sometimes spend 30 minutes going through various on demand content. Sometimes I recommend something and she says I don't want to watch that or vice versa. We go back and forth and sometimes we end up watching the same crap we always watch.
What if Netflix took all the guesswork out of this? We both want to watch new shows, but we don't know what to watch,. Hey honey, just flip to the comedy channel...nah, lets try a drama or maybe an action movie. We would really welcome something like this because otherwise it is very difficult to make up our minds.
@Dashrender and @scottalanmiller seem to be spending alot of energy on saying you don't need this. You are absolutely right. It's a feature of convenience and for me and many other couples that dont't exactly agree on TV preferences it would make things so much easier.
@Dashrender the recommend channel thing just doesn't work because you have to make a commitment to actually start the show. Before you start to watch the show, either the title, description, picture or whatever could turn you off on even getting that far. Then you have to watch the dumb intro and it takes you a good 5 minutes to get to any decent content within the show.
When you have a constant playlist going, you can get hooked into something. For example you may never consciously start an old Arnold movie from the beginning. When you switch to the action channel, you are the middle of an awesome gun fight. Who isn't going to get hooked into that for 10 minutes and maybe even finish the movie?
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@IRJ said:
@Dashrender and @scottalanmiller seem to be spending alot of energy on saying you don't need this. You are absolutely right. It's a feature of convenience and for me and many other couples that dont't exactly agree on TV preferences it would make things so much easier.
You are missing what we are saying. It's not even more convenient. Channels literally offer nothing. Every feature you mention is a feature we are do as well or better without a non-on-demand channel. If you want shows to start in mid-stream, even that can be replicated.
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@IRJ said:
When you have a constant playlist going, you can get hooked into something. For example you may never consciously start an old Arnold movie from the beginning. When you switch to the action channel, you are the middle of an awesome gun fight. Who isn't going to get hooked into that for 10 minutes and maybe even finish the movie?
No need for channels for that. You can do that on demand too. No idea why that would be good, but you can. The thing is, when on demand is available, everyone stops doing this.
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@scottalanmiller I don't understand why you are so adamantly against this idea. I guarantee you more MANY Netflix users would want this. I would not take alot of effort on Netflix's end to make this happen.
The whole point if you don't know what you want to watch, Why not have a constant stream you can peek in on. You don't have to peek in on it. You could still have all your content on demand. This is in addition to the way Netflix works. I am not saying to replace the current way Netflix works.
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@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller I don't understand why you are so adamantly against this idea. I guarantee you more MANY Netflix users would want this. I would not take alot of effort on Netflix's end to make this happen.
The whole point if you don't know what you want to watch, Why not have a constant stream you can peek in on. You don't have to peek in on it. You could still have all your content on demand. This is in addition to the way Netflix works. I am not saying to replace the current way Netflix works.
What I keep saying is... that's not the point. You keep saying reasons that you want channels, but we keep pointing out that channels aren't needed for the features that you want. All of that can be done with on demand systems. You want to know why I am so adamantly against it... it's because there is no reason presented for why it is superior. Flip it around, why are you so adamant about channels when every feature you mention can be done the same or better without traditional channels?
Netflix could make "channels" but it could make superior options for the same or less effort. What I'm saying is that channels are not necessary, playlists and an option to have things start "randomly" mid-stream cover all of those bases.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller I don't understand why you are so adamantly against this idea. I guarantee you more MANY Netflix users would want this. I would not take alot of effort on Netflix's end to make this happen.
The whole point if you don't know what you want to watch, Why not have a constant stream you can peek in on. You don't have to peek in on it. You could still have all your content on demand. This is in addition to the way Netflix works. I am not saying to replace the current way Netflix works.
What I keep saying is... that's not the point. You keep saying reasons that you want channels, but we keep pointing out that channels aren't needed for the features that you want. All of that can be done with on demand systems. You want to know why I am so adamantly against it... it's because there is no reason presented for why it is superior. Flip it around, why are you so adamant about channels when every feature you mention can be done the same or better without traditional channels?
Netflix could make "channels" but it could make superior options for the same or less effort. What I'm saying is that channels are not necessary, playlists and an option to have things start "randomly" mid-stream cover all of those bases.
The thing is I still have to chose what goes on there and where everything starts. That is the whole problem, I cannot chose what I want. Because I don't know what I want
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I think its a million dollar idea and its what Netflix needs to knock down the TV providers.
I might go pitch the idea on shark tank....uh never mind. Well maybe, if I add a QVC channel to the idea......
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@IRJ said:
The thing is I still have to chose what goes on there and where everything starts. That is the whole problem, I cannot chose what I want. Because I don't know what I want
You are combining the concept of channels with what Netflix offers today. You are missing that we keep saying that Netflix, with no effort, could offer everything you mention - literally everything, every feature, every caveat, without needing channels. Just because they don't do it doesn't mean that channels are the answer. They won't offer channels because it doesn't make sense. If channels made the slightest sense, they could offer every channel "feature" easier without using channels. That's what we are saying. Don't mix what they are offering with what they could offer.
Everything you've asked for with a channel can be done without a channel. Why do you keep insisting on the channel mechanism?
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@IRJ said:
@IRJ said:
I think its a million dollar idea and its what Netflix needs to knock down the TV providers.
I might go pitch the idea on shark tank....uh never mind. Well maybe, if I add a QVC channel to the idea......
Trust me, everyone who has used on demand services for the past fifteen years has thought of this, worked out how to do it and thus far, determined that it isn't worth any money. What you are proposing has been discussed a lot and always comes out to "no vendor cares because the value is too low." Trust me, I know exactly what you are asking for and it takes absolutely nothing for the vendors to provide. But they just aren't seeing a market for it. This idea goes back to the earliest days of Internet streaming services. @AndyW and I were working in this space, doing actual channels for radio, in the early 2000s - and even then no one would use them versus on demand based systems.
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@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller I don't understand why you are so adamantly against this idea. I guarantee you more MANY Netflix users would want this. I would not take alot of effort on Netflix's end to make this happen.
The whole point if you don't know what you want to watch, Why not have a constant stream you can peek in on. You don't have to peek in on it. You could still have all your content on demand. This is in addition to the way Netflix works. I am not saying to replace the current way Netflix works.
This describes the autoplay feature on YouTube pretty well. Choose something you like and it'll make a playlist of similar things.
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@MattSpeller said:
@IRJ said:
@scottalanmiller I don't understand why you are so adamantly against this idea. I guarantee you more MANY Netflix users would want this. I would not take alot of effort on Netflix's end to make this happen.
The whole point if you don't know what you want to watch, Why not have a constant stream you can peek in on. You don't have to peek in on it. You could still have all your content on demand. This is in addition to the way Netflix works. I am not saying to replace the current way Netflix works.
This describes the autoplay feature on YouTube pretty well. Choose something you like and it'll make a playlist of similar things.
That's a good start, but only does part of what he wants. It isn't curated (the "next" item is always garbage) and it never starts in the middle of a show. It's good, but not what he wants. But you could take that, use curated playlists and add a "start in the middle" feature and you meet or beet any channel system feature for feature, caveat for caveat.
