Resume Review Please
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We did a research project and interviewed over 30 HR Managers, IT Managers, CIOs, etc. There was an ultimate end goal for the company, but what I gathered from all of them was that a resume really depends on what you're trying to accomplish. Meaning, it depends on what type of job you're looking to get and the resume should be molded around that job.
Example... a helpdesk engineer would want to focus on the jobs that showcase those talents. Showing you worked at a bar in college probably doesn't matter to the hiring manager. Sure, you might be great with people, but it's not relevant to the job. If you're looking to be a CIO, some of those helpdesk jobs might not be worth adding in. I always found that molding the resume for the job increases your likelihood of getting the interview... from there, it's an entirely different ballgame.
A few of the key takeaways from our research:
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In many of the interviews I attended the hiring manager wanted to quickly find out what projects the candidate had completed or worked on and with what capacity. Did they manage it from start to finish?
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With those projects, (when they interview the candidate of course) they want to know what problems they ran into during it. If they managed the project they should be able to identify the problems and how they resolved them. This shows the hiring manager how well they could perform in other situations.
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The candidates experience shows the hiring manager that they were continuously working on something. Having a lot of experience is great, but are there any gaps in the time from one to another? Also, why did they have so many jobs, roles, etc. They said (again, depending on the role and level) a resume with more than three pages was too much. The candidate needs to consolidate their most important experience within these guidelines.
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Having a list of skills and your education/certification is a must have. I think almost all of the people we spoke to said this is important because they can tell if the candidate has seen the technology. It might not mean they are an expert, but it can get a shoe in the door to start a conversation.
That all being said, you, Mr. Scott Alan Miller, are not like the majority of the IT world. You have genius beyond that which is known to man and I would imagine it has to be difficult to consolidate many of your experiences. I would suggest making sure LinkedIn is up-to-date and try to limit the job roles listed. Maybe pull in the skills from those other roles starting at a certain year, like 2010 and previous and bring it all into a category.
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When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those employment gaps. What does that tell them?
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@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those employment gaps. What does that tell them?
It leaves speaking points during a conversation / interview.
My bigger question is what does this mean for the NTG team?
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@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
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@dustinb3403 said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those employment gaps. What does that tell them?
It leaves speaking points during a conversation / interview.
My bigger question is what does this mean for the NTG team?
Yeah, again, it's never cut and dry. There's no 100% right answer here. What I would say is if there's a big gap then add the dates in and detail what you were doing that could correlate to the job. For example, if you were working at an Office Depot as a sales manager and you're trying to get a helpdesk job, then focus on the people and if you ever got any awards for customer service, etc.
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@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
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@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
I've never worked anywhere that even received cover letters. They are normally, in my experience, stripped. I don't know any manager who gets them, or would look at them if received. To me, as a hiring manager, getting a cover letter tells me..
- The candidate doesn't value their own time and is spending time fruitlessly writing up a cover letter than has nearly zero chance of being seen and nearly zero chance of being read if seen.
- The candidate is desperate and willing to commit a lot of resources to a job before knowing if it is real at all (most posting by far are not), still open, or something that they'd even consider. It's way, way too early in the process to "care" at all about the potential job.
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@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
I've never worked anywhere that even received cover letters. They are normally, in my experience, stripped. I don't know any manager who gets them, or would look at them if received. To me, as a hiring manager, getting a cover letter tells me..
- The candidate doesn't value their own time and is spending time fruitlessly writing up a cover letter than has nearly zero chance of being seen and nearly zero chance of being read if seen.
- The candidate is desperate and willing to commit a lot of resources to a job before knowing if it is real at all (most posting by far are not), still open, or something that they'd even consider. It's way, way too early in the process to "care" at all about the potential job.
Yeah, it's definitely a tough call there. I don't typically read them when I get them from candidates either. I really wonder if the resume process and format in general needs an overhaul. Get people thinking about it in a different way rather than making assumptions based on what other people told them. Like, hey, you have to have your name here, your email here, then your objective, work experience like this, etc. I get it, standards are cool, but there has to be a better way!
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@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
I've never worked anywhere that even received cover letters. They are normally, in my experience, stripped. I don't know any manager who gets them, or would look at them if received. To me, as a hiring manager, getting a cover letter tells me..
- The candidate doesn't value their own time and is spending time fruitlessly writing up a cover letter than has nearly zero chance of being seen and nearly zero chance of being read if seen.
- The candidate is desperate and willing to commit a lot of resources to a job before knowing if it is real at all (most posting by far are not), still open, or something that they'd even consider. It's way, way too early in the process to "care" at all about the potential job.
I don't do cover letters. It would just include the stuff at the top of my resume anyways, but in more words. I think it's pointless. I did, however, include a cover letter to explain my reason for applying to international jobs, so they don't just toss out my resume when they see I'm from a different country. That seems to have worked a couple times.
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@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
I've never worked anywhere that even received cover letters. They are normally, in my experience, stripped. I don't know any manager who gets them, or would look at them if received. To me, as a hiring manager, getting a cover letter tells me..
- The candidate doesn't value their own time and is spending time fruitlessly writing up a cover letter than has nearly zero chance of being seen and nearly zero chance of being read if seen.
- The candidate is desperate and willing to commit a lot of resources to a job before knowing if it is real at all (most posting by far are not), still open, or something that they'd even consider. It's way, way too early in the process to "care" at all about the potential job.
Yeah, it's definitely a tough call there. I don't typically read them when I get them from candidates either. I really wonder if the resume process and format in general needs an overhaul. Get people thinking about it in a different way rather than making assumptions based on what other people told them. Like, hey, you have to have your name here, your email here, then your objective, work experience like this, etc. I get it, standards are cool, but there has to be a better way!
I'd prefer a universal standard that we "had" to follow within a scope. There is too much freedom now, I feel.
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@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@animal said in Resume Review Please:
@scottalanmiller said in Resume Review Please:
@obsolesce said in Resume Review Please:
When you leave out unrelated jobs to a position you apply for, the potential employer will notice those gaps. What does that tell them?
This is what I wonder... there is definitely a time to include and definitely a time to exclude. Avoiding gaps is often good, at least back to a certain point. And I like having a "starting point" on there, that shows what that "first job" is. For me this is an extra big deal because my starting job was long ago (1989), a very serious one (solo software engineering intern), and for a great company (Eastman Kodak was #19 on Fortune 100 while I was there.) Lots of people say they've been in IT or whatever and their starting date is based off of "I fixed my family's computer" or working in retail or something.
When I say that I've been in IT or SE for 30 years (technically not for a few more months) lots of people immediately say "we don't count playing with computers at home" and so having a Fortune 19 engineering job on there is pretty important.
I leave off my factory engineering work from a little later, or my restaurant and hotel management experience, and other things from about the same era, those are too unrelated.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense to include jobs that you worked at for a prestigious place, but that can also be done in a cover letter. We never got into the whole cover letter question whether they're worth it or not, but my feeling is that a resume is a bumper sticker, the cover letter is your story.
I've never worked anywhere that even received cover letters. They are normally, in my experience, stripped. I don't know any manager who gets them, or would look at them if received. To me, as a hiring manager, getting a cover letter tells me..
- The candidate doesn't value their own time and is spending time fruitlessly writing up a cover letter than has nearly zero chance of being seen and nearly zero chance of being read if seen.
- The candidate is desperate and willing to commit a lot of resources to a job before knowing if it is real at all (most posting by far are not), still open, or something that they'd even consider. It's way, way too early in the process to "care" at all about the potential job.
I don't do cover letters. It would just include the stuff at the top of my resume anyways, but in more words. I think it's pointless. I did, however, include a cover letter to explain my reason for applying to international jobs, so they don't just toss out my resume when they see I'm from a different country. That seems to have worked a couple times.
Yes, sometimes you have to point out that you KNOW where the job is.
Stupid that the opposite isn't true. Jobs from other regions reach out to me all the time and just ignore the fact that I'm not local.
