Phone system
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@scottalanmiller Just to be clear she is looking for the whole package. Including some sort of hosting, phones, call manager, various other features, and a mobile app for byod. That is what we are looking at.
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@jmoore
What exactly is a call manager? -
@dashrender Her term for the management side of things. Such as setting up groups, looking at logs, paying the bill, switchboard, and things like that.
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Her term for the management side of things. Such as setting up groups, looking at logs, paying the bill, switchboard, and things like that.
hmm.. I can't think of a single solution for that with FreePBX, but I'm sure a completely hosted solution like RingCentral can give you that in a single pane of glass.
My FreePBX solution requires two, The console to the PBX, and VOIP.ms for the billing.
No wait - three, because the billing and management of the PBX itself is hosted with Vultr.
and wait again - if you want caller ID, then there OpenCname.com -
@dashrender Ok cool thanks. So it really just depends on the requirements and a lot of ways to go about it. I have so much to learn lol.
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Ok cool thanks. So it really just depends on the requirements and a lot of ways to go about it. I have so much to learn lol.
Exactly.
I think JB mostly allows the customer to manage the separate accounts themselves, yet he is given access so he can manage the systems of those accounts.
In other words, the client has access to the billing side directly, and there's no markup from JB for doing that, then JB does his maintenance/break fix and sends them a bill for time spent.More work on the side of the customer, but also less cash out. I'm sure if the customers didn't want anything but a single monthly bill from JB, he'd be happy to do it, for likely a 20% upcharge to cover the cost of JB's employee pulling the data together into a single bill.
Either that, or a flat rate that's even higher than 20% more than the combined rates of all of the components to ensure he's left left holding the bag. Then at that point, you have to compare his prices to that of RingCentral.
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone and call manager software along with mobile apps. So we may be talking about different things here.
Ah, why do you need that stuff (real question?) What do you need to manage? Maybe the issue is that you are getting "manage it yourself" systems instead of a managed system where you need to do nothing at all?
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone .... mobile apps.
You only need demos of those things for systems that are proprietary and don't let you choose what you want. Nothing wrong with a demo or features, but "use anything you want" is the best demo. Basically, the demos you are seeing are demonstrations of limitations, not of features. For open systems, there isn't really anything like that to demo in the first place.
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@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dustinb3403 ok thanks, that makes sense. I asked the person doing the demo and she did not know about the software. I'll give my recommendation to host since that will be a little cheaper. My school is still going around with this /sigh. Thanks for your input Dustin
If you need a local area supplier....
Scott - who's doing your phone (VOIP like FreePBX) support these days?
What do you mean, we are. We are a phone vendor.
I mean who specifically? Mike was handling that for a while - and well, we've already talked about that.
Well, me for one.
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Just to be clear she is looking for the whole package. Including some sort of hosting, phones, call manager, various other features, and a mobile app for byod. That is what we are looking at.
I think she needs to talk to someone who is advising on phones, not just selling bundles. That approach is a guarantee that you can't get a good deal. Only high cost, big sales guy products come that way. Good products, industry standard ones, don't work like that. Imagine buying a server and wanting "all applications, desktops, and phones" to be bundled with your server purchased. Sounds crazy, right? That's identical here. The PBX is the server, the apps, phones, etc. are things that should never be "bundled", you just get the ones that are right for you and are free to use others when you want.
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@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone .... mobile apps.
You only need demos of those things for systems that are proprietary and don't let you choose what you want. Nothing wrong with a demo or features, but "use anything you want" is the best demo. Basically, the demos you are seeing are demonstrations of limitations, not of features. For open systems, there isn't really anything like that to demo in the first place.
99% of SMB don't want this. They want a solution. great it's open - now - what should I use to get mobile access? They expect an answer - not, anything you want. they don't/won't want to research the options - tell them two or three if you like, demo them for them, and let them choose, then never speak of it again, until they complain about something.
This is the world I have lived in. -
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Her term for the management side of things. Such as setting up groups, looking at logs, paying the bill, switchboard, and things like that.
None of that is needed. If you have that, you aren't in the ballpark of what I was proposing. That's actually getting way less, rather than more. Because she has to be the phone manager rather than getting a fully hosted service that takes care of that.
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@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone .... mobile apps.
You only need demos of those things for systems that are proprietary and don't let you choose what you want. Nothing wrong with a demo or features, but "use anything you want" is the best demo. Basically, the demos you are seeing are demonstrations of limitations, not of features. For open systems, there isn't really anything like that to demo in the first place.
99% of SMB don't want this. They want a solution. great it's open - now - what should I use to get mobile access? They expect an answer - not, anything you want.
I don't believe that. I think they just buy that because they turn to sales people willing to gouge them and they don't bother actually doing some basic research to see how phones work. I think 99% of SMBs would avoid this if they understood what they were buying.
They don't ACTUALLY want to get ripped off, they just don't want to "think about it" and get ripped off as a byproduct. There is a difference between wanting to be lazy and hoping that you can be lazy AND get a good deal. It's not realistic, but desiring to be lazy doesn't actually mean that they want a bad deal.
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@dashrender said in Phone system:
This is the world I have lived in.
I don't know where you find people like that in the real world. People I talk to, when the value of doing things well is explained, essentially always choose money in their pockets and easier time over getting a bad deal and doing extra work.
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@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Ok cool thanks. So it really just depends on the requirements and a lot of ways to go about it. I have so much to learn lol.
Right, you can't just get demos and think you are seeing what's out there for phones. The range of what is available is SO huge. Compare RingCentral to a 3CX system, to an NTG system... they are nothing alike, at all. They all make calls, they all are phones, but you interface and use them in three completely different ways. As different as can be.
RC you have to know what you are doing, pay a premium, live with their one way to work, and manage all setup yourself. 3CX you have to install, host, manage, but have flexibility. NTG you just say "we want phones" and everything is done for you, everything. You don't mess with phones, you don't set up lines, you don't need to be an expert and learn how to manage anything. Totally different approaches.
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@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone .... mobile apps.
You only need demos of those things for systems that are proprietary and don't let you choose what you want. Nothing wrong with a demo or features, but "use anything you want" is the best demo. Basically, the demos you are seeing are demonstrations of limitations, not of features. For open systems, there isn't really anything like that to demo in the first place.
99% of SMB don't want this. They want a solution. great it's open - now - what should I use to get mobile access? They expect an answer - not, anything you want.
I don't believe that. I think they just buy that because they turn to sales people willing to gouge them and they don't bother actually doing some basic research to see how phones work. I think 99% of SMBs would avoid this if they understood what they were buying.
They don't ACTUALLY want to get ripped off, they just don't want to "think about it" and get ripped off as a byproduct. There is a difference between wanting to be lazy and hoping that you can be lazy AND get a good deal. It's not realistic, but desiring to be lazy doesn't actually mean that they want a bad deal.
It would be awesome for you to keep stats on that for your next 100 new engagements to see what happens - are they willing to research themselves, or do they just ask you to present options.
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@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Her term for the management side of things. Such as setting up groups, looking at logs, paying the bill, switchboard, and things like that.
None of that is needed. If you have that, you aren't in the ballpark of what I was proposing. That's actually getting way less, rather than more. Because she has to be the phone manager rather than getting a fully hosted service that takes care of that.
So you're basically proposing RingCentral's solution ? and if not, what's the difference?
And don't just say, you get to pick any phone you want to use. -
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
NTG you just say "we want phones" and everything is done for you, everything. You don't mess with phones, you don't set up lines, you don't need to be an expert and learn how to manage anything. Totally different approaches.
This makes it SOUND like the most expensive option, because 100% of the work is done for you.
Notice I said sound.. perhaps NTG won't have such overhead (not the correct word) so they can pass along the savings and even though they do more work, actually cost less.
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@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller Well we are getting demos of phone .... mobile apps.
You only need demos of those things for systems that are proprietary and don't let you choose what you want. Nothing wrong with a demo or features, but "use anything you want" is the best demo. Basically, the demos you are seeing are demonstrations of limitations, not of features. For open systems, there isn't really anything like that to demo in the first place.
99% of SMB don't want this. They want a solution. great it's open - now - what should I use to get mobile access? They expect an answer - not, anything you want.
I don't believe that. I think they just buy that because they turn to sales people willing to gouge them and they don't bother actually doing some basic research to see how phones work. I think 99% of SMBs would avoid this if they understood what they were buying.
They don't ACTUALLY want to get ripped off, they just don't want to "think about it" and get ripped off as a byproduct. There is a difference between wanting to be lazy and hoping that you can be lazy AND get a good deal. It's not realistic, but desiring to be lazy doesn't actually mean that they want a bad deal.
It would be awesome for you to keep stats on that for your next 100 new engagements to see what happens - are they willing to research themselves, or do they just ask you to present options.
No one EVER wants us to just sell them crap. No one. Once you've engaged real consulting, you are definitely past that point. This simple never comes up.
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@dashrender said in Phone system:
@scottalanmiller said in Phone system:
@jmoore said in Phone system:
@dashrender Her term for the management side of things. Such as setting up groups, looking at logs, paying the bill, switchboard, and things like that.
None of that is needed. If you have that, you aren't in the ballpark of what I was proposing. That's actually getting way less, rather than more. Because she has to be the phone manager rather than getting a fully hosted service that takes care of that.
So you're basically proposing RingCentral's solution ? and if not, what's the difference?
And don't just say, you get to pick any phone you want to use.So from me explaining how we are completely different than RC in every way, you think we are proposing the same?
RC is "do it yourself", completely. They support you if things break, but there is no "support".
NTG PBX is 100% supported, so the polar opposite of RC. You do nothing, literally nothing. Rather than doing it all yourself.
