Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.
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@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
Unless ClamAV has gotten better in the last year or so, there's no way I'd trust it as my main line of A/V defense.
That's our take with ESET. Wouldn't trust it with any line of defense. Don't trust the product as it has a remote kill switch (that gets used.) And definitely can't trust the vendor, they are unethical and openly their customers' enemy. They are more of someone to protect the LAN against, not to let in the door. Lessons learned the hard way.
I'm not aware of this, can you provide me with some more info on this? It seems very important to know.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
It's great for central management, keeping definitions updated, showing if any devices are not up to date... shows if windows updates are not current as well.
I'm not giving a theoretical problem. I've used it. I've had every feature you mentioned disabled at will, randomly, but ESET the company in order to force us to be pressured to give them more money.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
Unless ClamAV has gotten better in the last year or so, there's no way I'd trust it as my main line of A/V defense.
That's our take with ESET. Wouldn't trust it with any line of defense. Don't trust the product as it has a remote kill switch (that gets used.) And definitely can't trust the vendor, they are unethical and openly their customers' enemy. They are more of someone to protect the LAN against, not to let in the door. Lessons learned the hard way.
I'm not aware of this, can you provide me with some more info on this? It seems very important to know.
What do you want to know? They did this to NTG and ALL of our customers, more than once. We've brought it up to ESET more recently. They claim that this is not company policy, but their actions say differently. They did nothing about it.
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@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
It's great for central management, keeping definitions updated, showing if any devices are not up to date... shows if windows updates are not current as well.
I'm not giving a theoretical problem. I've used it. I've had every feature you mentioned disabled at will, randomly, but ESET the company in order to force us to be pressured to give them more money.
Oh, well as with any service, if you don't pay the bill it gets cut off... we pay the bill we're fine. We don't pay the bill, we'll have another rsolution ready to replace ESET>
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They also don't allow technical support to deal with it, and their sales team would take multi-week vacations with no means of contacting them. They also didn't have a "restore" switch. The kill switch was one way. Once killed, the product was dead.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
It's great for central management, keeping definitions updated, showing if any devices are not up to date... shows if windows updates are not current as well.
I'm not giving a theoretical problem. I've used it. I've had every feature you mentioned disabled at will, randomly, but ESET the company in order to force us to be pressured to give them more money.
Oh, well as with any service, if you don't pay the bill it gets cut off... we pay the bill we're fine. We don't pay the bill, we'll have another rsolution ready to replace ESET>
Don't patronize me. We DID pay the bill. ESET tried to steal from us.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
we pay the bill we're fine.
Now you are saying I'm lying. It happened twice. We had to threaten legal action AND had to pay our staff to manually reinstall for all clients. ESET stole from us. They are crooks. They are exactly the people I'd not want with access to my network.
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@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
It's great for central management, keeping definitions updated, showing if any devices are not up to date... shows if windows updates are not current as well.
I'm not giving a theoretical problem. I've used it. I've had every feature you mentioned disabled at will, randomly, but ESET the company in order to force us to be pressured to give them more money.
Oh, well as with any service, if you don't pay the bill it gets cut off... we pay the bill we're fine. We don't pay the bill, we'll have another rsolution ready to replace ESET>
Don't patronize me. We DID pay the bill. ESET tried to steal from us.
I'm no trying to. I obviously know 0 details of what happened with your personal experience with ESET.
It's the first I've heard anything like it, and completely opposite of my experience with ESET in the 6 years I've been dealing with them at an enterprise level.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
It's great for central management, keeping definitions updated, showing if any devices are not up to date... shows if windows updates are not current as well.
I'm not giving a theoretical problem. I've used it. I've had every feature you mentioned disabled at will, randomly, but ESET the company in order to force us to be pressured to give them more money.
Oh, well as with any service, if you don't pay the bill it gets cut off... we pay the bill we're fine. We don't pay the bill, we'll have another rsolution ready to replace ESET>
Don't patronize me. We DID pay the bill. ESET tried to steal from us.
I'm no trying to. I obviously know 0 details of what happened with your personal experience with ESET.
It's the first I've heard anything like it, and completely is opposite of my experience with ESET in the 6 years I've been dealing with them at an enterprise level.
I've brought it up a ton, every time someone mentions considering ESET. They LITERALLY attempted to extort good, paying customers, twice. Lots of us. Pure, unmitigated extortion. Because they sold us the software and intentionally used a back door kill switch, they violated federal trade laws. They "took back" software they had sold to us which is the same as outright theft.
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You haven't had to deal with it because we went through it. Doesn't change the fact that they can't be trusted. They just can't pull that stunt any more because we've been so vocal about it since.
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@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
I've brought it up a ton, every time someone mentions considering ESET.
I've never seen anything about, regardless of how often you brought it up. I guess I just haven't opened those threads and seen it.
But now I'm aware of what they did, and I do believe you.
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So in this case, it's good that there is a gateway A/V since ESET 0%... good thing huh?
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
So in this case, it's good that there is a gateway A/V since ESET 0%... good thing huh?
That's a contrived case, though. Just put on a reliable AV product. Maybe the UTM has the same issue.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
@scottalanmiller said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
I've brought it up a ton, every time someone mentions considering ESET.
I've never seen anything about, regardless of how often you brought it up. I guess I just haven't opened those threads and seen it.
But now I'm aware of what they did, and I do believe you.
What's worse was that they provided no working contact information. Somewhere on SW you could track down a thread were we, and some others, believed that ESET went out of business as ALL of their available contact avenues dead ended. All of their available extensions pointed to each other and they had shut down their products. It was weeks that they were completely unreachable. They had pulled this extortion prank AND forgotten to ensure that they were even up and functioning with email or phones!
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There's a bigass ESET place in central San Diego... you can see it when you are driving. I know they exist.
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I hear everything you say about the gateway AV... but I've personally seen a lot of cases where the gateway AV had not been in place, the AV on the client did not detect or the lack of AV would not have detected.
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I'm sure most places may not need it at all, but some environments may.. such as those with a number of devices that may not have AV (not theoretical, because there's some that don't) and some with outdated definitions.
I've seen a lot of AV clients that are running outdated definitions... they are broken and wont update.
There's a lot of places a gateway AV makes sense. Maybe by your technical definition it's not layered security... but in a lot of cases it's the only layer, in which it becomes important... even though you can argue AV should be on those devices.
There are also devices like iPads that won't have AV... if one obtains ransomware on there from the internet... a point is to not even allow the ransomware on the network... block it before it even gets to a device.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
I hear everything you say about the gateway AV... but I've personally seen a lot of cases where the gateway AV had not been in place, the AV on the client did not detect or the lack of AV would not have detected.
That can happen, of course. But this implies that better AV is being used in one place and a lesser one is being kept in the more important place. The takeaway shouldn't have been "good thing we had a UTM", it should have been "oh boy, we need better AV clients."
Also, just because I don't like UTM doesn't mean that I am universally against network access layer AV scanning. I just never want that in my firewall. UTM isn't the same as "scanning AV on the network". The issue that Jared and I have with UTM is where that function is placed.
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@tim_g said in Arg! The money spent the month before I stated here.:
I'm sure most places may not need it at all, but some environments may.. such as those with a number of devices that may not have AV (not theoretical, because there's some that don't) and some with outdated definitions.
I've seen a lot of AV clients that are running outdated definitions... they are broken and wont update.
But the answer is... fix them. That makes the UTM a dangerous band aid... a false sense of security.
