Cell phones survey
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So, you asked for proof when you thought that I was crazy. I'll do the same. Now that we've established beyond any doubt that what we had seen was widely known, even admitted to by MS, and rampant the onus shifts and now the question is... did it get fixed and if so, when? I'm struggling to find any information from any source that shows that the issues were actually fixed. That you didn't know that there was this problem, and we know it was there recently, it's reasonable for us to assume that the issue still exists and that you just did not identify it. It can't be as bad, it would be impossible to use the phone if it hadn't improved some, but that it has actually been fixed seems very unlikely and pushing impossible. To have had it been so bad for three years, then have it miraculously fixed silently with no one talking about it? Seems reasonably unlikely.
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I guess myself and those around me are the only people in the world that haven't had a bad experience with Windows 10 and devices. Seems weird.
My wife uses a Surface 3 and has since it came out. Not a single issue except the typical micro USB crap. I used the 950xl since it came out, not a single issue, but needs a new battery.
None of this reflects badly on the Win10 OS.
Don't like their hardware? Get an Asus. That's what I'd do if I could do it over again, and I'd still use Win10.
If you don't want malware, don't use any store... Android, Apple, or Windows... They are all vulnerable. It wasn't Microsoft pushing the malware. People took advantage of a poorly designed system and also took Microsoft too much time to fix it.
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Recent article talking about how Microsoft still isn't screening the app store: http://windowsreport.com/windows-store-piracy/
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
If you don't want malware, don't use any store... Android, Apple, or Windows... They are all vulnerable.
As you know, aren't talking about vulnerabilities. We are talking about the vendor intentionally promoting malware. You are working very hard to defend them. But it doesn't work that way. What they did is wrong. It appears that they are still doing it. Maybe you know people that don't want to tell you what they've seen. Maybe you know people with similar misunderstandings of the store. I don't know, but this has been common knowledge for years. I'm not sure how you missed it in the past, but that you did and that it appears it's still a common problem, it's the logical, rational conclusion that the most likely thing is that you are just not aware of it now.
None of those other stores are similar. So either you are not understanding the problem, or intentionally trying to cover up for them. The later would suggest you no longer trust them either.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
It wasn't Microsoft pushing the malware.
Not according to the news. Microsoft didn't just promote it, they paid for some of it.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
None of this reflects badly on the Win10 OS.
That they paid to put malware into the Windows 10 Store that is part of the OS? How does that not reflect badly on it?
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
My wife uses a Surface 3 and has since it came out. Not a single issue except the typical micro USB crap. I used the 950xl since it came out, not a single issue, but needs a new battery.
You are lucky, two devices without one of them failing. You had a 25% chance of that. But that's how risk works, 25% chance is still decently high. As an MSP that has to support them, our failure rate is around 50%.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
Don't like their hardware? Get an Asus. That's what I'd do if I could do it over again, and I'd still use Win10.
Windows 10 isn't too bad. It's certainly not good, but not too bad. It's full of ads and it is super slow and the interface is... mediocre. but it isn't bad. But the things that they've done with the Store certainly reflect badly on it.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
I also cannot find any apps that "are" malware.
This one statement might be the key here. If we make one assumption, that you are seeing malware but not realizing it is malware - presumably because it is apps you are not interested in (DuoLingo is not a likely target for malware makers to make the app) it is easily there all the time and you just have no need to filter it out.
It's a reasonable assumption that malware apps use two main criteria to get good results:
- They choose apps missing from the Windows Store, not ones that are there from real vendors so there is no vendor to complain about it.
- They choose apps that are most likely to be used by less technical people who are more anxious to do something fun than to verify if the app is legit or not. Both making their infection rate higher and their chance of being reported lower. Although we've seen that MS doesn't respond to reporting anyway, so that might not be a real issue for malware makers.
Given those logical ways that malware would be targeted, it's apps like Facebook (recently pulled from certain Windows Phone platforms) or SnapChat or who knows what the hipster teenagers use to share food porn these days that are really big targets. Things where people will install them without thinking. Or apps that those people will pay for, without thinking. And apps for the elderly, maybe. Whatever those would be.
You are not likely a target candidate. You are risky. You would likely spot a malware app and you are more likely to report it. Both things that they want to avoid. You are anything but low hanging fruit.
So there is every reasonable chance that the issue here is that you use apps that tend to exist in the store and don't tend to use apps that are likely to be malware and you are not doing activities that cause you to notice malware. That doesn't mean that there is still malware, but all other references suggest that it is still there just like before, but it does mean that there is little reason to feel that just because you have not noticed it to assume that much has changed. That there has been some change, sure, but much? It would take very little change to create a very reasonable situation where the store could still be full of malware, even paid for and promoted malware that you do not see.
Remember, target marketing has come a LONG way in the last three years. Knowing how to make sure only people likely to fall for malware apps ever see them is a pretty trivial bit of intelligence for the store's search system to have. And that kind of intelligence would already be automated on platforms like Google or Facebook, so it's no stretch for it to be in the Windows Store. Even if it wasn't designed for that purpose, effective AI advertising campaigns would cause that to happen organically.
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I like Win10 mobile on my personal phone. I just do. I love the layout of everything and the functionality. I can quickly and easily do the tasks I need to do very efficiently, and the cherry on the top is how nice it looks. So I will continue to use it until I get a new phone which will kinda be soon-ish. I just like it. What else can I say.
It sucks they did that.. I don't know, but it doesn't effect me or anyone else in my life.
My next phone will most likely be Android because I want an Asus phone and want to get off o lf Win10 mobile before it crashes. If it doesn't then maybe ill come back in a few years.
The Windows app store on here... Well what choice do I have if I use Win10 mobile.
What I know for sure is that all "seems" well now.
Now professionally, no Windows Mobile, no Windows store, no exceptions. Its been like since the beginning.
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And please don't get me wrong. I respect MS quite a lot and I'm a fan of a lot of their technology and people. I know that MS is huge and operates as several different companies. My concerns come from their consumer groups, specifically their phone and desktop groups, which seem to have very flexible ethics compared to other parts of the company. Their server team, for example, is great, as is their XBOX team. Effectively each is a different company, and I feel that it shows.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
My next phone will most likely be Android because I want an Asus phone and want to get off o lf Win10 mobile before it crashes. If it doesn't then maybe ill come back in a few years.
I'm thinking about a ZenFone 4 for my next one. I've been burned by Androids (not Android itself, but every phone I've tried) but Asus has been so good to me, I feel good about testing one of their newer phones. I like the look and the features and the vendor. I want to get away from iPhone, but so far, have found no viable alternative. but I'm hopeful.
I'm not traveling heavily right now, so have an opportunity to test an Android again without the dangers of being stranded like I've been in the past when I foolishly tried that before.
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@scottalanmiller said in Cell phones survey:
@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
I also cannot find any apps that "are" malware.
This one statement might be the key here. If we make one assumption, that you are seeing malware but not realizing it is malware - presumably because it is apps you are not interested in (DuoLingo is not a likely target for malware makers to make the app) it is easily there all the time and you just have no need to filter it out.
It's a reasonable assumption that malware apps use two main criteria to get good results:
- They choose apps missing from the Windows Store, not ones that are there from real vendors so there is no vendor to complain about it.
- They choose apps that are most likely to be used by less technical people who are more anxious to do something fun than to verify if the app is legit or not. Both making their infection rate higher and their chance of being reported lower. Although we've seen that MS doesn't respond to reporting anyway, so that might not be a real issue for malware makers.
Given those logical ways that malware would be targeted, it's apps like Facebook (recently pulled from certain Windows Phone platforms) or SnapChat or who knows what the hipster teenagers use to share food porn these days that are really big targets. Things where people will install them without thinking. Or apps that those people will pay for, without thinking. And apps for the elderly, maybe. Whatever those would be.
You are not likely a target candidate. You are risky. You would likely spot a malware app and you are more likely to report it. Both things that they want to avoid. You are anything but low hanging fruit.
So there is every reasonable chance that the issue here is that you use apps that tend to exist in the store and don't tend to use apps that are likely to be malware and you are not doing activities that cause you to notice malware. That doesn't mean that there is still malware, but all other references suggest that it is still there just like before, but it does mean that there is little reason to feel that just because you have not noticed it to assume that much has changed. That there has been some change, sure, but much? It would take very little change to create a very reasonable situation where the store could still be full of malware, even paid for and promoted malware that you do not see.
Remember, target marketing has come a LONG way in the last three years. Knowing how to make sure only people likely to fall for malware apps ever see them is a pretty trivial bit of intelligence for the store's search system to have. And that kind of intelligence would already be automated on platforms like Google or Facebook, so it's no stretch for it to be in the Windows Store. Even if it wasn't designed for that purpose, effective AI advertising campaigns would cause that to happen organically.
I did a quick check for Snapchat, not a single app with that name or anything similar.
I gotta get going now... Not ignoring you but gotta head off for the night. I'll catch up tomorrow.
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I have a Motorola Moto GP, I think. It does the job, and when I kill it it's cheap to replace.
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@fuznutz04
try to make it :
- Android and from vendor or model that does not mess with the Android OS much
- 2-3 GB RAM, depending on your multi-tasking
- Equivalent to Snapdragon 625 and higher
- USB Type C for future goodness
- Vendor/Phone has good OS update plan
When i look for smartphones this is what majorly look for. I cant say brands like Motto or LG or HUAWEI just like we do with laptops we dont buy DELL or HP we buy an i5/8GB RAM/...etc and we start with fresh install.
I like Android cause of the competitiveness and you are in platform that guarantees everything will work.
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Just to throw my hat into the ring:
I have a Xiaomi Mi5s Plus and love it, the price is a definite bonus, plus the large storage capacity means it doesn't matter about no external storage (I have the 128GB and 6GB RAM model).
Not had any issues with it that I can remember, beats the Pixel in my experience and is far cheaper too
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@scottalanmiller said in Cell phones survey:
@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
My next phone will most likely be Android because I want an Asus phone and want to get off o lf Win10 mobile before it crashes. If it doesn't then maybe ill come back in a few years.
I'm thinking about a ZenFone 4 for my next one. I've been burned by Androids (not Android itself, but every phone I've tried) but Asus has been so good to me, I feel good about testing one of their newer phones. I like the look and the features and the vendor. I want to get away from iPhone, but so far, have found no viable alternative. but I'm hopeful.
I'm not traveling heavily right now, so have an opportunity to test an Android again without the dangers of being stranded like I've been in the past when I foolishly tried that before.
If I have to buy a phone I think I'm getting a Oneplus. From everything I've seen they are awesome.
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@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
@scottalanmiller said in Cell phones survey:
@tim_g said in Cell phones survey:
I also cannot find any apps that "are" malware.
This one statement might be the key here. If we make one assumption, that you are seeing malware but not realizing it is malware - presumably because it is apps you are not interested in (DuoLingo is not a likely target for malware makers to make the app) it is easily there all the time and you just have no need to filter it out.
It's a reasonable assumption that malware apps use two main criteria to get good results:
- They choose apps missing from the Windows Store, not ones that are there from real vendors so there is no vendor to complain about it.
- They choose apps that are most likely to be used by less technical people who are more anxious to do something fun than to verify if the app is legit or not. Both making their infection rate higher and their chance of being reported lower. Although we've seen that MS doesn't respond to reporting anyway, so that might not be a real issue for malware makers.
Given those logical ways that malware would be targeted, it's apps like Facebook (recently pulled from certain Windows Phone platforms) or SnapChat or who knows what the hipster teenagers use to share food porn these days that are really big targets. Things where people will install them without thinking. Or apps that those people will pay for, without thinking. And apps for the elderly, maybe. Whatever those would be.
You are not likely a target candidate. You are risky. You would likely spot a malware app and you are more likely to report it. Both things that they want to avoid. You are anything but low hanging fruit.
So there is every reasonable chance that the issue here is that you use apps that tend to exist in the store and don't tend to use apps that are likely to be malware and you are not doing activities that cause you to notice malware. That doesn't mean that there is still malware, but all other references suggest that it is still there just like before, but it does mean that there is little reason to feel that just because you have not noticed it to assume that much has changed. That there has been some change, sure, but much? It would take very little change to create a very reasonable situation where the store could still be full of malware, even paid for and promoted malware that you do not see.
Remember, target marketing has come a LONG way in the last three years. Knowing how to make sure only people likely to fall for malware apps ever see them is a pretty trivial bit of intelligence for the store's search system to have. And that kind of intelligence would already be automated on platforms like Google or Facebook, so it's no stretch for it to be in the Windows Store. Even if it wasn't designed for that purpose, effective AI advertising campaigns would cause that to happen organically.
I did a quick check for Snapchat, not a single app with that name or anything similar.
I gotta get going now... Not ignoring you but gotta head off for the night. I'll catch up tomorrow.
So a little about the Snapchat stuff. I had an HTC WP 8 device. Snapchat never released an app for WP. There was one developer who released a few apps (Snapchat, Instagram, 9Gag, and some others) using the APIs for the actual apps. Instagram finally released a "beta" (it was literally beta for like 3-4 years, it may still be) and his was better than the official app. For some reason MS pulled the Snapchat app and left the others.
I had a WP 8 and a WP 8.1 device. I loved the integration of social apps into 8. If I wanted to post something to Facebook I could just use the people hub (not that but whatever it was called at the time) and post without opening Facebook. It was the same with a few other platforms. When 8.1 hit they removed that feature for some reason. 8.1 had weird issues where I would get multiple of the same app running in the background and stuff wouldn't get laggy and jerky. It was just a worse experience overall.
However WP 8 had no VPN ability at all unless you had some corporate thing set up and when they finally released it in 8.1 I think it was only l2tp and IKE. I ended up just giving up on the platform.
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Again, another thread hijacked by @scottalanmiller, who should have forked this thread a long time ago as a different subject.
