It's Daylight Savings Time in the US
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@scottalanmiller said:
If this is true, all computing devices are incorrect. Look in Windows. GMT is time shifting, UTC is not. As an example.
On my Windows, I can't set GMT as a timezone. The only options are UTC plus or minus n hours. Regardless, it has to be a fudge, since we're operating in two different times zones (GMT & BST) and Windows only allows you to set one (plus a tick box for Daylight Saving Time).
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Looks like I am wrong. GMT does not change, but place that use it normally do. But it is important that GMT is a time zone and UTC is not, still. But it becomes a much more complicated matter because under this terminology, places like London and NY cannot be said to be "in" any particular time zone but choose one to honor from time to time.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
On my Windows, I can't set GMT as a timezone. The only options are UTC plus or minus n hours. Regardless, it has to be a fudge, since we're operating in two different times zones (GMT & BST) and Windows only allows you to set one (plus a tick box for Daylight Saving Time).
That's bizarre. I can set (and have) GMT on my Windows. And on my Linux.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@Carnival-Boy said:
On my Windows, I can't set GMT as a timezone. The only options are UTC plus or minus n hours. Regardless, it has to be a fudge, since we're operating in two different times zones (GMT & BST) and Windows only allows you to set one (plus a tick box for Daylight Saving Time).
That's bizarre. I can set (and have) GMT on my Windows. And on my Linux.
GMT is used interchangeably with UTC a lot, as evident even on this thread. However the main issue with GMT was the lack of leap seconds so it was slowly falling behind UTC, but not any more since they're now in some goofy balance I think.
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@scottalanmiller said:
That's bizarre. I can set (and have) GMT on my Windows. And on my Linux.
I thought I had. Otherwise I've been using UTC all these years and yet, as I mentioned earlier on this thread, I've apparently never heard of UTC. I thought maybe it was a Windows 8 change, but I've checked a Windows 7 PC and that's the same - no mention of GMT anywhere.
EDIT: Just checked a Windows 2003 Server machine, and that is GMT. So it must be a relatively new change.
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Here's my Windows 8.1 zone options.
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yaeh, that's what I remember.
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Is it bad that I love that fact that we are all so nerdy that we can make a 40-50 post discussion about TIME ZONES????
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That's how we roll!
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I've worked much of my career dealing with lots of time zones. Based in Eastern or Central, working for GMT or Pacific. And I'm about to be based in Europe, UTC + 1.
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@scottalanmiller said:
I've worked much of my career dealing with lots of time zones. Based in Eastern or Central, working for GMT or Pacific. And I'm about to be based in Europe, UTC + 1.
Oh, I think you mean Specific Time
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@scottalanmiller said:
@Carnival-Boy said:
I hate it. We only do it in the UK to keep the Scots happy apparently, so I was hoping that Scottish independence would mean we could abolish it.
How does it keep the Scots happy? It doesn't actually have any positive effect in any way.
It's not so much daylight saving that the Scots don't like, it's British Summer Time. England wants to move to BST in the winter (aka Central European Time), which would fall into line with the rest of central Europe, but that would mean it stays dark in Scotland until 10am.
There's also talk of double summer time, which is basically just us adopting Central European Time - so UTC+1 in the winter and UTC+2 in the summer, but personally I'd just stick to UTC+1 all year round.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
It's not so much daylight saving that the Scots don't like, it's British Summer Time. England wants to move to BST in the winter (aka Central European Time), which would fall into line with the rest of central Europe, but that would mean it stays dark in Scotland until 10am.
If the UK move to Central Europe time, why does anyone care that it is dark at 10am? They can just shift their hours later if they want. I've never understood this bizarre idea that changing the number shown on a clock that anything should be affected. You just change the hours that you do things to accommodate.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@Carnival-Boy said:
It's not so much daylight saving that the Scots don't like, it's British Summer Time. England wants to move to BST in the winter (aka Central European Time), which would fall into line with the rest of central Europe, but that would mean it stays dark in Scotland until 10am.
If the UK move to Central Europe time, why does anyone care that it is dark at 10am? They can just shift their hours later if they want. I've never understood this bizarre idea that changing the number shown on a clock that anything should be affected. You just change the hours that you do things to accommodate.
Logically that makes sense Scott, but we're creatures of habit. LOL you know that.
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@Dashrender said:
Logically that makes sense Scott, but we're creatures of habit. LOL you know that.
But wouldn't being a creature of habit apply equally to keeping the same schedule regardless of what time the clocks said? Seems like the forces of "habit by what the clock says" and "the time it really is" would equal out or lean towards the later. Especially when anyone in the white collar world or the business world, or shipping, or manufacturing, or international non-profits, or oil, etc., etc. has to deal with a global audience and local time changes mean nothing.
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What do you mean they mean nothing? I don't work in any of the fields you just mentioned, but when the time changes here in Nebraska, everyone I know goes to work either one hour later or earlier depending on which direction the swing goes.
This tells me we pay more attention to the number on the clock and not the position on the earth.
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Thankfully on my alarm clock, I just set the time zone and whether to use DST or not, and it always auto-sets the time as soon as you plug in power. It's about 3 minutes fast, but that's perfect for me actually.
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@Dashrender said:
What do you mean they mean nothing? I don't work in any of the fields you just mentioned, but when the time changes here in Nebraska, everyone I know goes to work either one hour later or earlier depending on which direction the swing goes.
Only because companies strangely keep their working hours the same as local time. Why would they do that when the clocks just changed? Makes no sense. Why wouldn't they keep each day to 24 hours, much more logical and natural. That the "time" changes is just a weird numerical thing. As someone with Aspy's, this is one of those wholly illogical things where I can tell that large groups of people doing something without any reason other than "lots of other people do it" but none of them have a reason.
I've literally never been told any reason why any organization shifts its "noon" away from true noon based on DST. If the gov't wants the clocks to read an hour different, who cares? What if AM and PM were switched, would people sleep in daylight? Actually, AM and PM were switched twenty years ago, no one even noticed.
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Television was the big one. When I was a kid, you came home from school, you watched Grange Hill, you had your tea, you did your homework, you watched Starskey & Hutch, you went to bed. Everything was scheduled around TV. If school started an hour later it would have thrown my whole world into chaos.
But with Netflix, and more flexible work hours for adults, time becomes less important. I reckon the next big thing that needs tackling is flexible school hours, but I'm not sure if that will ever be considered (it should be).
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@scottalanmiller said:
Only because companies strangely keep their working hours the same as local time. Why would they do that when the clocks just changed? Makes no sense. Why wouldn't they keep each day to 24 hours, much more logical and natural. That the "time" changes is just a weird numerical thing. As someone with Aspy's, this is one of those wholly illogical things where I can tell that large groups of people doing something without any reason other than "lots of other people do it" but none of them have a reason.
Why are you changing the number on the clock at all if not to have people shift when they are doing whatever it is they are doing? Originally, as I understand it, DST was done to save electricity etc by having more daylight available to people. So 70-80 years ago I can Maybe understand that, but today, it really doesn't save much if anything.
But I do agree with you that DST is definitely something we should do away with.Now as to the UK gov't wanting to match central Europe you have to ask yourself why they want this. I'm guessing because it would allow their workers to be online and active at the same time as those people in central Europe. Meaning that if the UK did change to UTC+1 or UTC+2, they would also be shifting their working schedules to match, otherwise why bother making the time change at all if they are going to continue to go to work at what would 6 AM and leaving at 3 PM central Europe time when in central Europe people go to work at 8 AM and leaving at 5 PM?
I've literally never been told any reason why any organization shifts its "noon" away from true noon based on DST. If the gov't wants the clocks to read an hour different, who cares? What if AM and PM were switched, would people sleep in daylight? Actually, AM and PM were switched twenty years ago, no one even noticed.
Are you talking about which 12 belongs to which? That's not really switching AM and PM.
