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    KVM Desktop Setup Ideas

    Water Closet
    fedora kvm virtualization hypervisor linux
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    • scottalanmillerS
      scottalanmiller
      last edited by

      Tags added.

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
      • IRJI
        IRJ
        last edited by

        Virtual box is terrible. I really don't know anyone who I would take seriously that uses it. If you want something that has great GUI and more than the basics available via GUI. Use VMware workstation. Yeah you have to buy it, but virtual box is so lame, slow, and has issues.

        Virt manager has the same options as virtual box, so when is there ever a reason to use virtual box?

        DustinB3403D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • DustinB3403D
          DustinB3403 @hobbit666
          last edited by DustinB3403

          @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

          Yeah i'll only ever be running 6 VM's at the most, also the "host" is a desktop machine that only has 16GB RAM at the moment. Hopefully upgrading to 32GB when i find a machine that can donate some RAM 🙂

          This part here is also a part of the confusion and why, we as professionals need to remove ambiguity from our conversations.

          As written this should be taken to mean "Using desktop class hardware". Nothing else is implied and it certainly isn't implied that this system would continue to be used as a "daily driver".

          It is because the assumption was made that this system would continue to be used as a daily driver that considerations of installing this system remotely, and managing it remotely were not considered and elevated the conversation to force a discussion about the intended use of the hardware.

          Besides running the 5-6 VMs that were already mentioned.

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • DustinB3403D
            DustinB3403 @IRJ
            last edited by

            @IRJ said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

            Virtual box is terrible. I really don't know anyone who I would take seriously that uses it. If you want something that has great GUI and more than the basics available via GUI. Use VMware workstation. Yeah you have to buy it, but virtual box is so lame, slow, and has issues.

            Virt manager has the same options as virtual box, so when is there ever a reason to use virtual box?

            No one has implied that the quality of any Type 2 hypervisor is worthwhile. We're still attempting (I think) to discuss how this hardware is intended to be used.

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
            • travisdh1T
              travisdh1 @DustinB3403
              last edited by

              @DustinB3403 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

              @dafyre said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

              KVM is also nice because you can continue using that machine as a regular desktop as well, if you need to do so. (Can't do that with VMware, Hyper-V or XenServer).

              No one expects to use their Type 1 hypervisor as a desktop.

              I use Hyper-V on my laptop all the time. Nothing that is actually a productive server, but lots of demos.

              DustinB3403D 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • travisdh1T
                travisdh1 @hobbit666
                last edited by

                @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                What combo is best to "get started" with KVM?

                It's just for a standalone machine to host 5-6 VM's.

                If they are all linux based, you could run 15 on that.

                scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • DustinB3403D
                  DustinB3403 @travisdh1
                  last edited by

                  @travisdh1 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                  @DustinB3403 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                  @dafyre said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                  KVM is also nice because you can continue using that machine as a regular desktop as well, if you need to do so. (Can't do that with VMware, Hyper-V or XenServer).

                  No one expects to use their Type 1 hypervisor as a desktop.

                  I use Hyper-V on my laptop all the time. Nothing that is actually a productive server, but lots of demos.

                  When you set out with the need to run VMs was the original intent to do so on your laptop, or later on was the question raised "can my laptop be used to act like a Type 1 hypervisor?"

                  The order of the questions matter, as they lead you to the result.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • scottalanmillerS
                    scottalanmiller @travisdh1
                    last edited by

                    @travisdh1 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                    @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                    What combo is best to "get started" with KVM?

                    It's just for a standalone machine to host 5-6 VM's.

                    If they are all linux based, you could run 15 on that.

                    If they are servers, not desktops. Most desktops will crap out at that low.

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • hobbit666H
                      hobbit666
                      last edited by

                      Wow this has become a long thread. Missed a load of stuff. Had a quick look over and need to clarify a few things.

                      I have a Desktop machine (Dell optiplex 9050, i7, 16gb Ram, 240ssd and 500sata)
                      This is going to be used as a lab only. Managed remotely like a server would. I've used ESXi before, XenServer, Hyper-V.

                      Even Windows 10 Pro with Virtual Box, VMware player and workstation. Windows 10 with Hyper-V enabled.

                      The only Hypervisor I haven't tried yet is KVM.
                      Hence the question where to Start.

                      It'll run a VM as a firewall
                      One Linux VM
                      Three Win10pro
                      (Because the Win10 VM's hence the need to upgrade the RAM)

                      DustinB3403D scottalanmillerS 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • hobbit666H
                        hobbit666
                        last edited by

                        When I say combo I mean what Distro as a base os (fedora seems to be popular) and what to use to manage it remotely.

                        ObsolesceO 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • ObsolesceO
                          Obsolesce @hobbit666
                          last edited by

                          @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                          When I say combo I mean what Distro as a base os (fedora seems to be popular) and what to use to manage it remotely.

                          Then I stand by the original few suggestions:

                          @Obsolesce said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                          @hobbit666 said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                          What combo is best to "get started" with KVM?

                          It's just for a standalone machine to host 5-6 VM's.

                          Fedora Server works great.

                          and

                          @scottalanmiller said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                          @hobbit666 said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                          What combo is best to "get started" with KVM?

                          It's just for a standalone machine to host 5-6 VM's.

                          I really like just using Cockpit. So I start with the latest Fedora which is 29. Install KVM. That's about it.

                          There are some things you will want that it lacks, but they are mostly around creating the VMs, not day to day. So while they suck and need to be done at the CLI, I still prefer it most of the time. At least for stand alones.

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • DashrenderD
                            Dashrender @DustinB3403
                            last edited by

                            @DustinB3403 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                            @coliver said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                            @DustinB3403 said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                            @dafyre said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                            KVM is also nice because you can continue using that machine as a regular desktop as well, if you need to do so. (Can't do that with VMware, Hyper-V or XenServer).

                            No one expects to use their Type 1 hypervisor as a desktop.

                            I have VMs on my local desktop with Hyper-V. Not production but they are good for a lab.

                            Is it your expectation to use XenServer as a desktop?

                            FFS did I say something that was confusing.

                            This is not an expectation generally made that a Type 1 Hypervisor can also be used as a daily driver. Persons who do this are making a case in which they need a daily driver and a Type 1 Hypervisor.

                            It is not the normal expectation.

                            I'm late to this - but I absolutely want this - hell I want this for normal users so they can be more protected.

                            scottalanmillerS jmooreJ 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • scottalanmillerS
                              scottalanmiller @Dashrender
                              last edited by

                              @Dashrender said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                              @DustinB3403 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                              @coliver said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                              @DustinB3403 said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                              @dafyre said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                              KVM is also nice because you can continue using that machine as a regular desktop as well, if you need to do so. (Can't do that with VMware, Hyper-V or XenServer).

                              No one expects to use their Type 1 hypervisor as a desktop.

                              I have VMs on my local desktop with Hyper-V. Not production but they are good for a lab.

                              Is it your expectation to use XenServer as a desktop?

                              FFS did I say something that was confusing.

                              This is not an expectation generally made that a Type 1 Hypervisor can also be used as a daily driver. Persons who do this are making a case in which they need a daily driver and a Type 1 Hypervisor.

                              It is not the normal expectation.

                              I'm late to this - but I absolutely want this - hell I want this for normal users so they can be more protected.

                              I think you could with VDI. Just gets expensive.

                              DashrenderD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                              • DustinB3403D
                                DustinB3403 @hobbit666
                                last edited by

                                @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                Wow this has become a long thread. Missed a load of stuff. Had a quick look over and need to clarify a few things.

                                I have a Desktop machine (Dell optiplex 9050, i7, 16gb Ram, 240ssd and 500sata)
                                This is going to be used as a lab only. Managed remotely like a server would. I've used ESXi before, XenServer, Hyper-V.

                                So this here means every assumption made about "using this as your daily driver" was clearly wrong. And pinpoints the reason why these questions need to be asked.

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                                • scottalanmillerS
                                  scottalanmiller @hobbit666
                                  last edited by

                                  @hobbit666 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                  I have a Desktop machine (Dell optiplex 9050, i7, 16gb Ram, 240ssd and 500sata)
                                  This is going to be used as a lab only. Managed remotely like a server would. I've used ESXi before, XenServer, Hyper-V.
                                  .....
                                  The only Hypervisor I haven't tried yet is KVM.

                                  So wait, it's desktop hardware, but being treated as a server? That's totally different.

                                  KVM, yes, obviously since that is part of your goal. But definitely not with a local screen. This goes back to ... "I like Cockpit."

                                  If you are just trying to learn, take a look at oVirt, too.

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • DashrenderD
                                    Dashrender
                                    last edited by

                                    d0fe8515-8651-4b74-9e55-7ed7821e3e37-image.png

                                    These three posts seemed to lead to all the problems

                                    @hobbit666 mentions that he's using desktop hardware
                                    which leads @dafyre to assume "regular desktop"
                                    Which leads Scott to assume daily driver (though not said in this post)

                                    Now we find out 10 mins ago that this machine while being consumer hardware will in fact be used as a typical, likely headless server.

                                    dafyreD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • DashrenderD
                                      Dashrender @scottalanmiller
                                      last edited by

                                      @scottalanmiller said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @Dashrender said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @scottalanmiller said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @Dashrender said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @scottalanmiller said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @Dashrender said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @DustinB3403 said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                      @coliver said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                                      @DustinB3403 said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                                      @dafyre said in What Are You Doing Right Now:

                                      KVM is also nice because you can continue using that machine as a regular desktop as well, if you need to do so. (Can't do that with VMware, Hyper-V or XenServer).

                                      No one expects to use their Type 1 hypervisor as a desktop.

                                      I have VMs on my local desktop with Hyper-V. Not production but they are good for a lab.

                                      Is it your expectation to use XenServer as a desktop?

                                      FFS did I say something that was confusing.

                                      This is not an expectation generally made that a Type 1 Hypervisor can also be used as a daily driver. Persons who do this are making a case in which they need a daily driver and a Type 1 Hypervisor.

                                      It is not the normal expectation.

                                      I'm late to this - but I absolutely want this - hell I want this for normal users so they can be more protected.

                                      I think you could with VDI. Just gets expensive.

                                      Yeah - normals would love VDI if there was a super easy/cheap way to do it.

                                      It's not THAT bad these days.

                                      Normal users would have a hard time paying $100/yr for it - hell I can't get normals to pay $50/yr for offsite/online backups.

                                      Is it that much now? I don't think so.

                                      You can get Windows VDI for less than $100/yr? I thought the VDI license was that much alone, let alone someone's platform upon which to run it.

                                      Also is VDI in someone else's DC now legal? I thought it wasn't for a while there because you didn't know what hardware it was on? - though I might be misremembering that.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • dafyreD
                                        dafyre @Dashrender
                                        last edited by

                                        @Dashrender said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                        d0fe8515-8651-4b74-9e55-7ed7821e3e37-image.png

                                        These three posts seemed to lead to all the problems

                                        @hobbit666 mentions that he's using desktop hardware
                                        which leads @dafyre to assume "regular desktop"
                                        Which leads Scott to assume daily driver (though not said in this post)

                                        Now we find out 10 mins ago that this machine while being consumer hardware will in fact be used as a typical, likely headless server.

                                        To be fair, you are correct, I did assume "regular desktop". However, that still doesn't change my recommendation of KVM + Virt-Viewer (I use Virt-Viewer to manage a couple of KVM servers).

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • Emad RE
                                          Emad R @hobbit666
                                          last edited by Emad R

                                          @hobbit666

                                          AMD Ryzen and disable SMT, get something with NVMe M2 storage, buy cheapest m2 storage, install OS there, make RAID on the SATA disks, or something else, and use those as VM storage

                                          coliverC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • coliverC
                                            coliver @Emad R
                                            last edited by

                                            @Emad-R said in KVM Desktop Setup Ideas:

                                            @hobbit666

                                            AMD Ryzen and disable SMT, get something with NVMe M2 storage, buy cheapest m2 storage, install OS there, make RAID on the SATA disks, or something else, and use those as VM storage

                                            Why? Your OS gets loaded to memory having it on an SSD when your actual workloads aren't doesn't make a lot of sense.

                                            DashrenderD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
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