What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
As far as I know, sales tax is the only one not built in. Cigarettes and booze have their non sales tax baked in.
Question, is there sales tax on gasoline? I assume there is and for whatever reason it’s just baked in...
What makes it sales vs. non-sales tax? Are cigarette and alcohol taxes collected prior to sale time (easily they are, I've never sold either.) If they have non-sales tax baked in, isn't that defeating any goals of making sales tax visible?
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@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
Good morning sunshine. Given the choice, I'll keep it like it is in the US - don't include taxes.
Why? It just complicates things.
Imagine if you weren't shown the total amount when pumping gas....
I did not see this before making my mention of gas prices
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
I'm also not really sure what he's trying to get at? Taxes don't become buried if they are added to the sticker price. It is still incredibly easy to find sales tax rates for counties/states, as well as tax rates for specific things.
It is? The tax rates of things were not broken out on many receipts when I was traveling... But almost all, if not all do in the US - the major exception is gasoline. Normal people (myself included) have no clue how much of the cost of gasoline is taxes.
Hiding this information only serves to keep people from rioting when they see high taxes.Which is why it is important! You don't want society deciding on a tax, then people who have to pay that tax constantly getting emotional over and over again because they forget, then remember, then forget, then remember. So this is a solid reason, in addition to making things simple, why it's important not to separate it out.
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@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
I'm also not really sure what he's trying to get at? Taxes don't become buried if they are added to the sticker price. It is still incredibly easy to find sales tax rates for counties/states, as well as tax rates for specific things.
It is? The tax rates of things were not broken out on many receipts when I was traveling... But almost all, if not all do in the US - the major exception is gasoline. Normal people (myself included) have no clue how much of the cost of gasoline is taxes.
Hiding this information only serves to keep people from rioting when they see high taxes.In NY you pay 45 cents per gallon. With an additional 16 cents per gallon for federal taxes. So 61 cents per gallon is taxes. This is slightly lower if you don't live in NYC and slightly higher depending on local sales taxes. Just a decent ball park figure.
I have client in the industry. I can get the cost of the fuel coming out of the pipeline, if you want.
Taxes for Fuel are not added until the terminal dispenses the fuel into the tanker truck.
Those taxes are Federal and State. Any Local or Sales tax is the only tax added at the station.
That would be interesting to know, if you can.
NL 87 Octane: $1.63
Fed MFT tax: $0.184
MO MFT tax: $0.1649
MO UST tax: $0.0025
MO Inspection Fee: $0.007 -
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
I'm also not really sure what he's trying to get at? Taxes don't become buried if they are added to the sticker price. It is still incredibly easy to find sales tax rates for counties/states, as well as tax rates for specific things.
It is? The tax rates of things were not broken out on many receipts when I was traveling... But almost all, if not all do in the US - the major exception is gasoline. Normal people (myself included) have no clue how much of the cost of gasoline is taxes.
Hiding this information only serves to keep people from rioting when they see high taxes.In NY you pay 45 cents per gallon. With an additional 16 cents per gallon for federal taxes. So 61 cents per gallon is taxes. This is slightly lower if you don't live in NYC and slightly higher depending on local sales taxes. Just a decent ball park figure.
I have client in the industry. I can get the cost of the fuel coming out of the pipeline, if you want.
Taxes for Fuel are not added until the terminal dispenses the fuel into the tanker truck.
Those taxes are Federal and State. Any Local or Sales tax is the only tax added at the station.
That would be interesting to know, if you can.
NL 87 Octane: $1.63
Fed MFT tax: $0.184
MO MFT tax: $0.1649
MO UST tax: $0.0025
MO Inspection Fee: $0.007Missouri, where you always pay Mo' taxes.
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@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
I'm also not really sure what he's trying to get at? Taxes don't become buried if they are added to the sticker price. It is still incredibly easy to find sales tax rates for counties/states, as well as tax rates for specific things.
It is? The tax rates of things were not broken out on many receipts when I was traveling... But almost all, if not all do in the US - the major exception is gasoline. Normal people (myself included) have no clue how much of the cost of gasoline is taxes.
Hiding this information only serves to keep people from rioting when they see high taxes.In NY you pay 45 cents per gallon. With an additional 16 cents per gallon for federal taxes. So 61 cents per gallon is taxes. This is slightly lower if you don't live in NYC and slightly higher depending on local sales taxes. Just a decent ball park figure.
I have client in the industry. I can get the cost of the fuel coming out of the pipeline, if you want.
Taxes for Fuel are not added until the terminal dispenses the fuel into the tanker truck.
Those taxes are Federal and State. Any Local or Sales tax is the only tax added at the station.
That would be interesting to know, if you can.
NL 87 Octane: $1.63
Fed MFT tax: $0.184
MO MFT tax: $0.1649
MO UST tax: $0.0025
MO Inspection Fee: $0.007That's per gallon correct? Hmm, it's more than I thought actually. interesting.
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@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@coliver said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dustinb3403 said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Time for me to look into prepaid. my bill can drop from $124 to $85 each after taxes.
Or you could just go T-Mobile and get unlimited everything for a flat $70 per month, taxes and fees included.
Prioritization is actually 50GB with TMo, not 22.
Unlimited with att prepaid is $60 now
Before taxes.
Is this weird? Any time I look to buy something I immediately assume it's before tax and S&H. Are most items in your part of the country listed including taxes?
My main point was to point out that I'm currently paying around $122/m after taxes...
The ATT Prepaid unlimited is $60 for first, and $55 for second, plus taxes makes it about $125 after tax... so it's a pretty close wash as far as price goes, and it moves me from 15 Shared GB/m to unlimited* (* data speeds slowed after 22 GB at ATT's discretion).
I was just asking, as sometimes I find I'm the "weird" one.
It would make sense for taxes to be included in the sticker price. Not sure why NY, and other states, don't do that.
Yes and no. I like the simplicity of seeing a price on the shelf and knowing that that's the price I'm spending before I walk up to the checkout counter (a la most of Europe - maybe more places), but I don't like that fact that the taxes then become a buried thing and basically we the people become divorced from what we are being charged for taxes.
You can't have it both ways. FFS stop bitching up both sides of the river.
I'm also not really sure what he's trying to get at? Taxes don't become buried if they are added to the sticker price. It is still incredibly easy to find sales tax rates for counties/states, as well as tax rates for specific things.
It is? The tax rates of things were not broken out on many receipts when I was traveling... But almost all, if not all do in the US - the major exception is gasoline. Normal people (myself included) have no clue how much of the cost of gasoline is taxes.
Hiding this information only serves to keep people from rioting when they see high taxes.In NY you pay 45 cents per gallon. With an additional 16 cents per gallon for federal taxes. So 61 cents per gallon is taxes. This is slightly lower if you don't live in NYC and slightly higher depending on local sales taxes. Just a decent ball park figure.
I have client in the industry. I can get the cost of the fuel coming out of the pipeline, if you want.
Taxes for Fuel are not added until the terminal dispenses the fuel into the tanker truck.
Those taxes are Federal and State. Any Local or Sales tax is the only tax added at the station.
That would be interesting to know, if you can.
NL 87 Octane: $1.63
Fed MFT tax: $0.184
MO MFT tax: $0.1649
MO UST tax: $0.0025
MO Inspection Fee: $0.007That's per gallon correct? Hmm, it's more than I thought actually. interesting.
That was Thursday.
And that base cost was set the day before, but it was set on fuel that was actually purchased 2-3 months ago, that just arrived from the pipeline.
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@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
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@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
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@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
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@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
And if the fee was BS - don't you think they should be sued?
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
And if the fee was BS - don't you think they should be sued?
They were forced to pay huge settlements at least one time I remember.
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
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@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
But you're not alone, so everyone has to incur these fees. So what you're telling me that that the big boys were overcharging so much already that they just decided to eat the cost, where the small ISPs couldn't? I get that, that's a cost of being small.
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
But you're not alone, so everyone has to incur these fees. So what you're telling me that that the big boys were overcharging so much already that they just decided to eat the cost, where the small ISPs couldn't? I get that, that's a cost of being small.
Correct,
But not to confuse “BS Fees” I was referring to actual fraudulent fees Verizon added
Pople.
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
But you're not alone, so everyone has to incur these fees. So what you're telling me that that the big boys were overcharging so much already that they just decided to eat the cost, where the small ISPs couldn't? I get that, that's a cost of being small.
Right,
But by “BS Fees” I meant Verizon was charging fraudulent fees.
Sales tax people understand.
Telecom tax people don’t, so in my opinion the fee reporting structure is also open to abuse, and has clearly been abused.
In addition it’s a pain in the ass lol
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@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
But you're not alone, so everyone has to incur these fees. So what you're telling me that that the big boys were overcharging so much already that they just decided to eat the cost, where the small ISPs couldn't? I get that, that's a cost of being small.
Correct,
But not to confuse “BS Fees” I was referring to actual fraudulent fees Verizon added
Pople.
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@bigbear said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
With telecom there are some "truth in billing" things that seem like they are just there to make everyone crazy.
Depending on which telecom lawyer you ask you will get a different answer about what to do.
Examples?
It means you have to break out all the taxes and fees the same way you break out sales tax. USF fees are optional to breakout but you have to charge exact amounts and label them as the exact amount you paid.
Before this you may remember Verizon getting sued several times over BS "Recovery fees".
But the whole thing costs so much to bill, track and report that its a nightmare.
Really? It does? Why does it? Don't you already have to track these fees to pay them to their respective companies/gov't agencies anyhow? How hard is it to pull that data from a DB to include on the bill?
What DB? Lol
You have to charge based on the end price including federal, state, local per tenant.
Ok the forms you don’t have to break out tenant info just count and fees remitted.
If it weren’t for this 499a requirement and 477 you could just pay it upstream and bill it as a a service plus sales tax. The taxes still got paid.
And because of this you got 10 to 20 hours of tax prep per month by a telco tax firm given your size, which also isn’t cheap.
But you're not alone, so everyone has to incur these fees. So what you're telling me that that the big boys were overcharging so much already that they just decided to eat the cost, where the small ISPs couldn't? I get that, that's a cost of being small.
Right,
But by “BS Fees” I meant Verizon was charging fraudulent fees.
Sales tax people understand.
Telecom tax people don’t, so in my opinion the fee reporting structure is also open to abuse, and has clearly been abused.
In addition it’s a pain in the ass lol
most things these days seem to have a half dozen or so taxes on them.. WTF.. /sigh
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@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
As far as I know, sales tax is the only one not built in. Cigarettes and booze have their non sales tax baked in.
Question, is there sales tax on gasoline? I assume there is and for whatever reason it’s just baked in...
What makes it sales vs. non-sales tax? Are cigarette and alcohol taxes collected prior to sale time (easily they are, I've never sold either.) If they have non-sales tax baked in, isn't that defeating any goals of making sales tax visible?
Cigarette have tax stamps paid for before sale.
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@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@dashrender said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@jaredbusch said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
@tim_g said in What Net Neutrality Means to You SAMIT Video:
It's just a really weird and actually a deceiving concept. You can tell it has U.S. written all over that concept.
In Japan, it is a 50/50 shot on whether or not they display the post tax price or not.
Holy hell - that has to be a nightmare for consumers.
Just like in the US, just not 50/50. In the US there is no labelling rule. So we assume no tax, except that's not true. On gas, for example, you always assume taxes have been added in. Cigarettes is like part added in and part not.
As far as I know, sales tax is the only one not built in. Cigarettes and booze have their non sales tax baked in.
Question, is there sales tax on gasoline? I assume there is and for whatever reason it’s just baked in...
What makes it sales vs. non-sales tax? Are cigarette and alcohol taxes collected prior to sale time (easily they are, I've never sold either.) If they have non-sales tax baked in, isn't that defeating any goals of making sales tax visible?
Cigarette have tax stamps paid for before sale.
And there are signs about cigarette bootlegging when you cross into Illinois from Missouri.
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I thought this was interesting... ( It is long, but gives historical and informational reference to the issue.)
Youtube Video
